batten parrells

  • 17 Jun 2017 09:29
    Reply # 4904857 on 4904648
    Erik and Evi Menzel Ivey wrote:
    David Tyler wrote:

    No single answer, Pete, but I might suggest a rule of thumb: let the after part of the batten parrels  make an angle of 30° with the batten.

    David - if the batten parallel are being used to both hold the battens to the mast and limit the sail from moving forward, does the 30 deg angle still apply?


    Erik

    There's no single, right answer, Erik. You can go for maximum limitation of forward movement with a shorter parrels and greater angle, accepting more friction, or you can go for freer  fore and aft movement and less friction with longer parrels and a lesser angle.

    As I've already said, with your scaled up weaverbird sails, you will need to have longer than the minimum length of batten parrels, to keep the friction down. Subject to trials, I suggest (but no more than suggest) that an angle of 30° will be suitable, with extra control being supplied by running luff parrels. I also suggest that you leave yourself some wiggle room as to where you attach the parrels to the battens, so that you retain the option of adjusting their length after sailing trials.

  • 17 Jun 2017 08:54
    Reply # 4904813 on 4890691
    Anonymous member (Administrator)
     

    Pete

    David suggests 30° between the after part of the batten parrel and the batten. That makes sense, and should ensure low friction. However, there is a bit more to it than that. In general, the closer the CG of the sail sits to the mast, the less it will want to fall forward, and the less are the forces needed (from batten parrels or other lines) to hold it back. In plain English this means that high-AR sails, and sails set with a big balance, are more forgiving in this respect. The worst are the low-AR sails set with very little balance.

    The challenge is to land on a compromise where the sail sits where we want it to, and where the friction between batten parrel and mast is acceptable.

    The sails I have made lately are in the “difficult” class, being quite low and broad. On the hi-res photo, below left, I have shifted the sail of my Ingeborg maximum forward without moving the batten parrels. I did so by lengthening the standing tack parrel, TP. As can be seen (enlarge the photo), the batten parrels will restrict the sail from falling forward when reefing. The friction is noticable when hoisting and lowering, but the sail still comes down by itself without jamming, so it is OK. A glance at the halyard shows that it is next to vertical, so it is not pulling the sail forward.

    On the photo to the right, taken recently, the sail has been pulled just a bit further aft with the throat hauling parrel, THP, after hoisting. The TP has also been shortened again, just a few centimetres, to make the PVC jacket on the boom reach the mast.

    On a schooner the AR of the sails are generally much higher than sloop sails, so there is a good hope that you will get away with fairly little balance and short batten parrels. It is important that the mainsail is restricted from falling forward, as the clearance between the two sails tends to be on the short side.

    A final advice is to make the masts tall enough so that the angle between it and the halyard stays within 20-30°.

    Arne

     



  • 17 Jun 2017 03:28
    Reply # 4904648 on 4890926
    David Tyler wrote:

    No single answer, Pete, but I might suggest a rule of thumb: let the after part of the batten parrels  make an angle of 30° with the batten.

    David - if the batten parallel are being used to both hold the battens to the mast and limit the sail from moving forward, does the 30 deg angle still apply?


    Erik

  • 11 Jun 2017 18:25
    Reply # 4891785 on 4890691
    Deleted user

    Don't know if this helpful or not but for my sail I used Arne's Froken Sorensen sail plan, page 6 and scaled the measurements to my sail. You can bring the pocket opening on the aft side of the mast of the mast a bit further aft if you may need more balance

    Last modified: 11 Jun 2017 18:27 | Deleted user
  • 10 Jun 2017 13:26
    Reply # 4890926 on 4890691

    No single answer, Pete, but I might suggest a rule of thumb: let the after part of the batten parrels  make an angle of 30° with the batten.

  • 10 Jun 2017 09:37
    Message # 4890691
    Deleted user

    my boat is 36 feet  and will be rigged as a schooner I am interested in the length of the batten parallels is there a percentage of how long they should be or is it hit and miss

    any thoughts greatly appreciated

    pete j

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