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Converting a Morris Frances 26?

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  • 11 Feb 2015 20:31
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    Reply # 3223727 on 3177329
    Deleted user

    Darn, sure, but I doubt it will be anytime soon. I looked at the placement of an unstayed mast right where the upper deck lowers to the bow deck space, and there is a limited space, diameter wise for it, because of bulkheads.. I'll post a photo when I can get to the boat next and get the measurement.


    Gil.
  • 11 Feb 2015 14:22
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    Reply # 3223438 on 3177329
    Deleted user

    Gil,

    The next time you pull the mast, could you find a way to weigh it and its attending standing rigging?

    It would be useful information to have when considering freestanding mast choices.

    Dennis
  • 05 Feb 2015 15:35
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    Reply # 3218413 on 3177329
    Deleted user

    Interesting, thanks! It might be a while before I get to convert the boat. I want to play with the original rig for a while and see how it goes. I am pretty broke after the purchase. I will however keep gathering information and knowledge towards that goal. I could even start building support for the mast, get a sail, get the boat ready little by little and when the right time comes, swap!

    Gil.
  • 31 Jan 2015 12:54
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    Reply # 3214682 on 3177329
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    In the Mars 2015 issue of Practical Boat Owner, which I just received, David Harding has a full review of the Frances 26. I cannot copy the whole article for you, but let you have his verdict as a teaser.

    I think the Frances 26 is a lovely boat, except for the god-awful masthead Bermuda sloop rig. Even with that mast raking 12.0m above the waterline (if the illustration in PBO is correct), there is only room for 31.1sqm sail. With a displacement of 3084kg (6800lbs) that gives a SA/disp. factor of only 14.7 or  a SA/weight = 10.1 sqm/metric ton.

    A not extreme SA/disp. factor of 20 would call for a SA=42.4sqm,
     which gives a SA/weight =13.7 sqm/ton  -  36% more muscle pr. ton than the Bm rig.

    And remember; this bigger JR sail could be hung on a mast  which is around 2m shorter than that Bm mast.

    I just mention it...

    Arne

     
  • 31 Jan 2015 05:58
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    Reply # 3214589 on 3214546
    Anonymous member
    Gil G. wrote:

    Darn.. It would seem though that since the junk rig is so easy to reef, using more sail area than strictly necessary wouldn't hurt, if the mast is light enough.. That would imply reefing sooner, but so what?

    Gil, you are playing Arne's tune.  This is exactly what he thinks, says and does.
  • 31 Jan 2015 03:13
    Quote
    Reply # 3214546 on 3177329
    Deleted user
    A junk rigged Frances would be a very poor performer indeed."

    Darn.. It would seem though that since the junk rig is so easy to reef, using more sail area than strictly necessary wouldn't hurt, if the mast is light enough.. That would imply reefing sooner, but so what?

    Gil.
  • 30 Jan 2015 23:20
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    Reply # 3214438 on 3177329
    Anonymous member

    I can only assume that Chuck Paine is not up to date with what we've been doing with the rig in the last few years. I found this on http://bluewaterboats.org/frances-26/, which doesn't seem to stack up with his comments:

    With a high ballast to displacement ratio, in excess of 50%, owners comment she can hold onto her full sail area well after many others have reefed. You’ll find this boat easily driven with excellent directional stability and surprisingly fast. 

    At 3ft 10in, she's not exactly shoal draught (The Sib-Lim design I'm working on is shoal draught, at 1ft 9in!), though she's not particularly deep either. She's a good boat that will take the junk rig as well as any other.

    Last modified: 30 Jan 2015 23:43 | Anonymous member
  • 30 Jan 2015 22:55
    Quote
    Reply # 3214423 on 3177329
    Deleted user

    Gil,

    I contacted Chuck Paine himself and asked him about converting a Frances to junk rig.

    His response:

    "The Frances hull is not well suited to a junk rig. Being shoal draft, it needs every advantage in the rig to get it to point somewhat well. This means a slender (aluminum or carbon fiber) mast and clean leading edge to the jib. A junk rigged Frances would be a very poor performer indeed."

    I would be interested in the response of the experienced JRers to the opinion of the boat's designer.


    Dennis
  • 30 Dec 2014 06:11
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    Reply # 3178133 on 3177329
    Deleted user

    Sure thing Dennis, if I ever sell it, I'll call you first.

    Gil.
  • 29 Dec 2014 13:45
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    Reply # 3177731 on 3177329
    Deleted user

    Gil,

    You got the one in Stuart which went before I got a chance to get there from Connecticut.  If you get tired of bumping your head, let me know. Seriously.


    I am at work and will send you the sources of flag poles when I get home


    Dennis
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