S2 6.7 Junk Rig Conversion

  • 08 Dec 2019 05:52
    Reply # 8211324 on 8209644
    Scott wrote:

    I will plan to do this as well. I found my tiny hack saw. I think it should work for squaring up the corners.

    I started working on getting the core out with a chisel. Balsa is more difficult to break apart than I expected. I am happy it is not plywood.

    Do you have a recommendation for a hard wood to use? My first thought was oak. Then I read on the West System website that oak should never be used with epoxy. I can't seem to find any ash boards. Poplar looked good, but then I found people online saying it is no good for boats due to poor water resistance.

    The price of maple terrifies me. Hickory I have only found as flooring sold by the case.

    At the moment I think Douglas Fir seems like the best option for 'hardwood strips' even if it is not really hardwood. 

    You might find a multitool is a good choice for this job, Scott.

    Go for the oak, Scott, as long as it is seasoned.  (a) we are just talking trim here (b) John Guzzwell recommends it in his book (c) Tystie is trimmed out in oak and has had no problems with bits falling off. It supposedly has a reputation for not gluing that well: so has teak.  I've never (touch wood!) had a problem with either. 

    To ease your mind, just be more than usually scrupulous in ensuring that both surfaces are well wetted out first and maybe even wipe it with solvent.  If you look here, you will find more about gluing it from the Gougeon Bros.  But don't forget, you are not using it structurally.


  • 08 Dec 2019 01:52
    Reply # 8209644 on 8175658
    David wrote:

    I would also cut away the radii in the corners. If the corners are square, it will be easier to bond on pieces of hardwood trim to cover the messy edge.

    I will plan to do this as well. I found my tiny hack saw. I think it should work for squaring up the corners.

    I started working on getting the core out with a chisel. Balsa is more difficult to break apart than I expected. I am happy it is not plywood.

    Do you have a recommendation for a hard wood to use? My first thought was oak. Then I read on the West System website that oak should never be used with epoxy. I can't seem to find any ash boards. Poplar looked good, but then I found people online saying it is no good for boats due to poor water resistance.

    The price of maple terrifies me. Hickory I have only found as flooring sold by the case.

    At the moment I think Douglas Fir seems like the best option for 'hardwood strips' even if it is not really hardwood. 

  • 04 Dec 2019 15:28
    Reply # 8175658 on 6872873

    I would also cut away the radii in the corners. If the corners are square, it will be easier to bond on pieces of hardwood trim to cover the messy edge.

  • 04 Dec 2019 02:24
    Reply # 8170666 on 8163493
    David T wrote: I would rather chisel out the core to a depth of 1 1/2" all the way around, bond in hardwood strips in to fill that cavity, then bond and bolt the plywood on top. Having done that, an extra two squares of thick plywood of smaller size, surrounding the tabernacle, will transfer the load satisfactorily, to the larger square.

    Thank you. This seems to be a very good plan. Hopefully after I chisel out 1.5" I will have solid dry core all around.

    Your help is very much appreciated.

    Scott


  • 03 Dec 2019 08:54
    Reply # 8163493 on 6872873

    Both skins of the deck are clearly structural. It's not the same as having a thick deck, some core, and then a thin headlining inside. So the question is, how to get a strong join to it? For fastening on deck fittings, the usual way is to make a large hole through one skin and the core, fill the cavity with a strong epoxy and filler mix, then drill through that solid plug for a bolt. That would work, to bond and bolt a thick piece of plywood (18mm or 3/4") over the hatch hole. However, I would rather chisel out the core to a depth of 1 1/2" all the way around, bond in hardwood strips in to fill that cavity, then bond and bolt the plywood on top. Having done that, an extra two squares of thick plywood of smaller size, surrounding the tabernacle, will transfer the load satisfactorily, to the larger square.

  • 02 Dec 2019 21:44
    Reply # 8158580 on 8153183
    David T wrote:

    I think we need more information and pictures to be of specific help to you, Scott.


    Hi David,

    Thank you for taking the time to respond. I will attach all the photos I took when I was at the boat. 

    I am not sure what information to provide. The tabernacle will be buried in the deck approximately 890mm. For selecting a mast I came up with a target yield strength of 1753 kpm. I would like to determine what sort of deck structure I need to ensure that the deck will not crush or collapse if and when the mast really sees that 1753 kpm load.

    If I understand all those numbers correctly then I think the deck will need to withstand a force equivalent to 1970 kg applied sideways. I am not sure where to go from there.

    13 files
    Last modified: 02 Dec 2019 21:50 | Anonymous member
  • 02 Dec 2019 09:33
    Reply # 8153183 on 6872873

    I think we need more information and pictures to be of specific help to you, Scott. Generally, though, mast partners on a GRP boat can be made by stacking up layers of plywood locally, not all the way out to the deck edge. A plywood deck beam will help stiffen the whole area, if the boat is lightly built.

    1 file
  • 02 Dec 2019 00:23
    Reply # 8149264 on 6872873

    I need some advice on mast partners.

    I do not remember any specific scantlings from PJR. I would appreciate any opinion.

    I removed the hatch on my S2 yesterday. Unfortunately there is rot in some of the balsa. Fortunately it is not in ALL the balsa. I will be sure to repair any damaged core.

    Beyond repair I am not sure what I should do. 

    Including the gelcoat but not the headliner the deck is about 18mm thick. About 12mm is balsa. It is about 2.5mm of polyester and fiberglass on each side and just about 1mm of gelcoat. I attached a photo.

    Is it enough to fill in the hatch area with a similar layup? Or does it need to be double this much all the way out to the hull side in each direction? 

    1 file
    Last modified: 02 Dec 2019 00:30 | Anonymous member
  • 22 Nov 2019 16:46
    Reply # 8134944 on 6872873

    Thank you Arne, David and Annie.

    I missed the part about Pete recommending biaxial fiberglass. I already put down one layer of fiberglass (woven tape) and epoxy on the inside of the port and starboard tabernacle pieces.

    I am planning on epoxy and fiberglass then two-part polyurethane paint above the deck. I hope this will give me a structure that will last many years without too much maintenance. The price tag on Interlux Perfection is a little shocking. Does anyone have something else to recommend?

    Below the deck I am tempted to use primer and latex paint to save some money.

    I am fairly confident that the epoxy cured properly before the temperature dropped back down to 33 DegF last night. I may bring it inside the house for a post cure.

    I will need to wait for warmer weather or maybe buy an electric blanket before I get anything else done.

    Last modified: 22 Nov 2019 16:50 | Anonymous member
  • 21 Nov 2019 09:43
    Reply # 8132584 on 6872873
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    David Tyler’s thinking around using glass sheathing makes sense to me.

    I have used glass sheathing on two wooden masts, mainly to get a good protection against abrasion. The first mast was Malena’s hollow mast (1995). The (West epoxy) glassing was then given seven coats of two-pot polyurethane varnish, over twice the recommended. Still, after around 13 - 14 years, the glassing showed signs of coming apart on the sunny side. Since the owner didn’t take action, water ingress led to rot, and in 2011 the mast was scrapped. To me it looked as if the varnish held, but even on 59°N, it let through enough UV radiation to destroy the epoxy underneath.

    The second wooden mast, the one for Johanna (2002), was given the same glassing, but this time the coating was white, two-pot polyurethane paint. I hope that this will hold better. It looked good when I sold Johanna in 2014.

    The two wooden topmasts of my hybrid masts (2013 and 2016) have only been painted with many coats of polyurethane paint, without any glassing. So far, they look good.

    What I want to try is to use polyurethane varnish as resin when glassing. If the stuff penetrates and saturates the glass nicely, then one can have a very strong and long-lasting surface. Since the glass will be invisible on more than 50cm distance, one could  have a nice clear-varnish finish (as on Malena’s mast), which will last ‘forever’.
    I will try this on a piece of plywood, once the temperatures rise again...

    Arne


    Last modified: 21 Nov 2019 09:43 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
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