New sail for Tystie

  • 16 Apr 2012 13:46
    Reply # 890707 on 833895

    Dear David,

    still sorry to hear you have moved away from the wing-sail.  Perhaps it is a type most suited to multi-hull craft.  Efficiency being more important to maximum drive. 

    Good to see you are going with the sleeved yard. 

    Regarding fabricating Carbon-fibre spars, I recall that Mike Burroughs (the guru of wierd bicycle builder / designers) made frames from carbon on foam cores as you suggest.  His method of 'bagging' was to wrap round & round with electrical tape.  cheap effective, if not the best finish.  Early windsurfer masts must have been similar as they have a spiral ridge.

    cheers

    Mark

     

    Last modified: 16 Apr 2012 13:47 | Anonymous member
  • 15 Apr 2012 19:57
    Reply # 890196 on 833895
    Ah, if only we lived in a perfect world, life would be simpler. If there had been room for a tapered deck ring, I'd have just fitted wood wedges, and thought no more about it. Because, for various reasons, I ended up with a parallel gap of 5mm all around at the deck, I had to use a poured solution to the problem of wedging. At the heel, the problem was similar to Jonathan's, with nasty noises generated by a little bit of movement. It was problem free for for 7 years and 50,000 miles, and it only took a couple of hours to get the mast out, and it doesn't need to be so long to fit the new boat it's going into, so Spartite wasn't a disaster. Just don't want to do it again.
  • 15 Apr 2012 17:35
    Reply # 890094 on 833895
    I think that it was something like that but I will ask and confirm.  I seem to remember that it was important that any second pour was done before the first pour had gone off and that the time to do that was short.  It might therefore not be quite as simple as you suggest because you would need to remove the temporary wedges before the Sparlight had cured.  Ah, I remember something now!  The poured in Spartight needs to have a dam floor to rest on whilst it cures and this was formed by stuffing in strips of a hard foam from underneath.  I think that the top of this would then have been faired with release agent.  As well as forming the floor for the Spartight, these would have held the mast in the centre of the deck hole, or wherever in the hole that you wish the mast to end up.  In my case it was definitely in the centre because the masts are vertical and the plug ended up round.  This temporary floor was then removed from below.  However, detail of the professionals' method to follow, I hope.  jds
  • 15 Apr 2012 15:37
    Reply # 890039 on 833895
    Deleted user
    Maybe I shouldn't ask questions for stuff I know I'll figure out on the day.
    Install 4 temporary short wedges to hold mast, pour Spartite around. When cured, remove wedges, fill holes with more Spartite. Finished.
  • 15 Apr 2012 11:43
    Reply # 889986 on 833895
    "Good question.  Well asked!"  I can't remember, but that is nothing unusual these days.  Mine was done by Allspars with the boat afloat and I don't recall it being a problem.  However, it was three years ago and there was a lot going on at the time and I don't now remember the detail.  I am in Plymouth in the next few days and I will ask and let you know.  jds
  • 15 Apr 2012 04:04
    Reply # 889880 on 889480
    Deleted user
    Jonathan Snodgrass wrote:.. There is no need for mast boots.  I think that Spartight is magic. 
    I'm wondering Jonathan, how the spartite is applied on an unstayed mast. Considering mine will be stepped while boat is in the water, might be a little rocking going on. I can see how the bermudian set have it easier..
  • 14 Apr 2012 11:58
    Reply # 889480 on 833895
    My experience of Spartight has been very good.  When I bought Lexia and set off down the Irish Sea to do a 500 mile qualifying passage for OSTAR 2009 she had hard wood chocks at the deck partners.  One of my first big scares was that they groaned and cracked and moved alarmingly.  I now understand that if I had known more at that time I might have been able to get them seated satisfactorily.  However, I consulted All Spars of Plymouth and they replaced the chocks with Spartight.  For the subsequent 3,000 plus miles this worked very satisfactorily.  However, the next big scare from nasty noises was from the step of the main mast during AZAB 2011.  So, on return, I had Allspars lift out the main mast to repair the mast step and it made sense to have the foremast lifted to undertake a number of other repairs and modifications.  Both masts came out without any struggle.  The Spartight came out with the masts like corks out of an old fashioned medicine bottle.  When they first put the Spartight in, All Spars  had used a release grease on both the parallel sided mast and the well tapered hole through the deck.  The Spartight plugs released from the deck holes but barely moved on the masts.  However, when the mast were out, the plugs of Sparlight were quite loose on the masts and could be moved up and down.  To put the masts back in, we tapped the plugs to move them up the mast a little, dropped in and stepped the masts and then tapped the Spartight plugs home.  The plug to deck and plug to mast joins were again sealed with a run of silicone sealant.  This has so far proved to be water tight.  There is no need for mast boots.  I think that Spartight is magic. 
    Last modified: 14 Apr 2012 11:59 | Anonymous member
  • 14 Apr 2012 10:01
    Reply # 889467 on 889462
    David Tyler wrote:Jeff suffered, Lesley suffered ... and then it was my turn. Getting out a mast that's been stuck in with Spartite, that is. ........

    And Spartite is on my list of Things I Will Never Do Again.

    Correct me if I am wrong, but what is common for all three cases (that is apart from the Spartite). I believe that none of you had a reverse taper on either the mast or the partner/step. One of them has to have a reverse taper or you will suffer.  You also must, absolutely must throughly  grease the side that contacts the reverse taper. If the above is done, the mast usually comes out without to much trouble.

    If both sides have a taper, the reverse taper must be quite a bit more that the taper on the other side. Else it will still jam.


  • 14 Apr 2012 09:14
    Reply # 889462 on 833895
    Jeff suffered, Lesley suffered ... and then it was my turn. Getting out a mast that's been stuck in with Spartite, that is. I clamped on two large timbers, to get good turning leverage. Couldn't turn the  mast. So I went upriver to Mahurangi marina, and went under the mast lifting gantry. Lifting and turning together didn't do much. So I cut off the mast at cabin sole level. Still no movement. So we chiselled away at the gap between the (unbolted) alloy deck ring and the deck. Finally, the mast jumped 2 ft in the air,as  the bond broke.
    So now Tystie is officially a ketch no longer, but is a sloop again. It's strange having a big space where the mizzen mast used to be, like having a tooth out. The hole in the deck will probably have a 10" square Maxwell hatch put over it. It's just where I could use some more ventilation in the tropics, and I will be able to see the head of the new sail from my perch on the engine box. The hole in the cabin sole is in the process of being filled in, before I break my leg.

    And Spartite is on my list of Things I Will Never Do Again.
  • 16 Mar 2012 23:17
    Reply # 861040 on 857697
    Slieve McGalliard wrote:

    Hi David

    Please go the DIY way, BUT, please write it up step by step complete with materials, suppliers and costings. I think there would be a big readership for such information.

    Cheers, Slieve

    Slieve,
    I've bought the carbon braid from Soller composites LLC , in New Hampshire, USA. They will ship worldwide. The prices quoted are very high for small quantities. Ask for a quotation for quantities large enough for a set of battens, and the price will go down. However, it will still be a high-cost option, and if I could have bought alloy in the lengths and spec I need, I wouldn't be considering it.
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