Tabernacle Scantlings

  • 28 Apr 2018 07:53
    Reply # 6123840 on 4557363
    Anonymous

    Thank you Scott, for putting the right link in place!

    Graeme - I edited your post to point the link to your public, instead of your private profile.

    Mark

  • 27 Apr 2018 14:21
    Reply # 6122534 on 4557363

    Thank you Scott and Graeme! There is a lot of good information in these links.

    Graeme, I had to go into your profile to see your tabernacle images. The links you sent did not work.

    This worked for me:

    Tabernacle

    Last modified: 27 Apr 2018 14:34 | Anonymous member
  • 26 Apr 2018 23:28
    Reply # 6121886 on 4557363
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Scott Y, I am continuing with an aluminium tabernacle (but slow, other matters have intervened.)

    It seems to me that the matter of scantlings does not require the calculations which Scott D has been considering - in fact Scott D came pretty close to the heart of the matter by quoting Pete Hill's "General Rule" - which in essence is: "The tabernacle needs to be at least as strong as the mast at this point." 

    Pete makes tabernacles for wooden masts, but the principle ought to apply to any material.

    The tabernacle is essentially three-sided (a U-section), which is simple to have made out of aluminium plate, by an engineer with a heavy duty folder. To allow the simple attachment of a fourth side (and to give additional strength) the two arms of the U can be folded out to make a flange - it is now a "top hat" section. There is a picture of what I mean here.

    If the folded aluminium tabernacle is made from plate which is the same specification as the mast it encloses, then the resulting section should be as strong (or stronger) than the mast it encloses. There is a discussion about it on this thread, including a rather clever solution suggested by David T viz using castable polyurethane to make the mast a snug fit in the tabernacle.

    So far no welding (although I am welding a tube at the top aft edge of mine, to accommodate a hinge pin later.) I was going to stay off this topic until mine is completed and proven, but I am weighing in here with a couple of points in case Scott Y or anyone else is thinking of doing the same.

    First point: if using David's suggestion of castable polyurethane, it would probably be better to have the two sides of the U-section flaring slightly, by a degree or two. It is too late for me to do that now.

    The other point is the deck flange, which seems to have been a nagging issue on this thread. It seems to me (not proven yet) that there is no need for the cost, trouble and potential weakening of the tabernacle from welding a flange. My intention is to clad the outside of the tabernacle with plywood (or possibly thin solid wood panel), over the surface area where it intersects with the deck - and a few inches above and below. I think it should just need to be stuck onto the aluminium with simpsons glue, before the tabernacle is fitted into the boat. From then on, regarding the deck/tabernacle watertight detail the tabernacle will be treated as if it were wood, and made integral with the deck structure in the normal way. I would like to know from the experts if there are any issues with this, though I will probably do it anyway because I am committed now. I am going to take a punt that this detail will outlast the plywood deck.



    Last modified: 28 Apr 2018 07:51 | Anonymous
  • 26 Apr 2018 17:07
    Reply # 6121417 on 4557363
    Deleted user

    Hi Scott,

    I abandoned it - David talked me out of it on this thread.

    But there's good conversation about it if you're interested in tabernacles anyway.


    Last modified: 26 Apr 2018 17:07 | Deleted user
  • 26 Apr 2018 01:45
    Reply # 6120533 on 4557363

    Hi Scott,

    Do you have a moment to give an update on your tabernacle design? I would like to hear how things went. Do you now have some practical experience to share?

  • 19 Jan 2017 19:00
    Message # 4557363
    Deleted user

    There is an amazing lack of information on the Internet regarding tabernacle scantlings.   I'm hoping that those with practical experience will weigh in here. 

    Note: (I had posted some really bad math regarding this on another thread, now deleted.  Apologies to anyone who had tried to follow it.  At least I'm not snapping out half-informed 3 a.m. tweets on complex foreign policy issues like some of my high-ranking countrymen.) 

    Pete Hill, in JRA's Issue 61, February 2013 wrote a helpful article on the tabernacles he's built over the years.  He also gives his general guideline on scantlings:

     "I make the cross sectional area of the tabernacle at least as large as the cross sectional area of the lower part of the mast, suing the same material as for the masts ((usually Douglas fir).  For example, for a 7in x 7in mast base (49 square inches), the sides are 2 in x 9 in, and the back is 2 in x 7 in (50 square inches)...   All my masts have been wooden, so I am not sure how these scantlings would translate to an alloy mast."

    David Tyler recommended something similar.

    Using Pete's general rule:

    According to the PJR, my equivalent wood mast is 13 inches in diameter, which is 78.5 sq in. (The actual mast is 10" diameter Aluminum 6063-T6, 0.25 inch wall thickness.)  I'd need tabernacle sides about 2 in x 12 in, and a back of 2 in x 14, equal to 76 sq in.

    The assumption is that we're talking about Douglas fir here, too.  That's about 70 board feet of Doug fir, weighing 183 lbs.   That smells a bit high weight-wise, but visually seems to make sense.

    For comparison, that same section of mast, if I don't use a tabernacle, is only 50 lbs. 

    A second approach: 

    The Yield Strength of Al 6063-T6 = 21,000 psi.  The Modulus of Rupture for White Ash (of which I have plenty in my garage) is 15,000 psi.  A quick use of the stress formula 3FL/bd^2 says that I'd need a 11.2 inch diameter white ash cylinder to get the equivalent strength of the mast.  Which is a lot lower than Pete's method gives, and calls for only 0.6 inch thick sides and back if I snugged it up to the mast.  That's just silly thin.  

    Then there's stiffness.  White Ash is known for its ability to bend. I don't want a whole lot of bending going on, though.  So thicker is better there.

    My boards are about 6" wide. I intend to rip them flat sawn 4/4 white ash boards in 1.75" strips, turn every other one end for end, rotate each 90 degrees, and glue them up.  The result is a quatersawn gluelam.  I've done a few rudders and centerboards this way using just dimensional lumber, 2x6 or 2x8 from the local big box store, and I'm amazed at the stability and strength.   The result will be 1.75" thick tabernacle sides and back.

    Anybody want to stop me before I make a mistake? 

    Last modified: 20 Jan 2017 18:57 | Deleted user
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