Time to get junk rigged!

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  • 17 Oct 2013 10:48
    Reply # 1414746 on 1414460
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Stavanger, Thursday

    Hi Oscar

    I checked your calculations of the 188mm mast and came to the same strength as you (assuming that 400MPa is right). However, when guesstimating your boat’s max righting moment, I came to 1600kpm. I guessed the righting lever to be 1/ 4.5 beam= 0.53m while it seems you guessed it to be 1/ 4 of the beam; 0.6m. A mast of 90 kg will add 3% to your boat, which can be felt, but is still tolerable. That is about the same as the mast of my boat, Johanna, but you get away with much less windage (Johanna’s wooden mast is 250mm).

     

    Anyway, I think the 188mm section should be strong enough. I think that my early mast calculations may have been too conservative. This is because I used Practical Junk Rig to guide me, and their formulas are very sail area sensitive and lead to heavy masts. In the other end of the scale is the Needle spar masts. These super thin “knitting needles” have coped surprisingly well, but have also failed from time to time. Therefore, the “right” masts should be somewhere between these schools of thought. These days I tend to conclude that a strength factor of around 2 is high enough for a going-anywhere boat.

     

    A 105kg mast begin to sound heavy for a 27’ boat of just 3ton, so I would avoid it. In other words, if I were in your shoes, I would go for the 188mm mast. The 3mm walls should be plenty thick enough to avoid denting and buckling.

    Good luck!

    Arne

  • 17 Oct 2013 02:37
    Message # 1414460
    My plan was to convert to junk rig this last summer but things didn't quite according to plans. In any case I don't have to worry about my appendix getting infected while at sea anymore. One issue I've had while planning the conversion, since buying the boat in late 2012, was the fact that it seems impossible to get a hold of tapered aluminum poles in Finland. Which leaves me with a few alternatives:

    1. Wooden mast, solid
    + easy construction
    + inexpensive
    - heavy

    2. Wooden mast, hollow
    + lighter than solid wood
    - construction is more difficult, somewhat depending on build method

    3. Aluminum + wood (or GRP) hybrid
    + relatively light
    - construction difficulty somewhere between 1 and 2

    4. Steel
    + not much construction at all
    - about as heavy as a solid wooden mast

    As the winter is approaching I won't have the luxury of a) finding a suitable piece of spruce and b) drying it in time to go sailing next summer, and a full lenght hollow mast would also require space I don't have access to at the time being. This leaves hybrid and steel (carbon fiber is way too expensive).

    As for the boat specs, my humble ship is 8.3 meters LOA (27 ft), 2.4 m (7 ft 10 in) beam, 3 tons displacement. It's pretty similar to a Pearson Triton.

    I've been leaning towards a steel mast, as I recently got a decent price quote for hot dip galvanized tapered steel poles. The two options are:

    #1
    Length: 10600mm (~34 ft 9 in)
    Base: 188mm (~7 3/8 in)
    Top: 60mm (~2 3/8 in)
    Wall: 3mm (~1/8 in)

    #2
    Length: 11100mm (~36 ft 7/16 in)
    Base: 208mm (~8 3/16 in)
    Top: 76mm (~3 in)
    Wall: 3mm (~1/8 in)

    I've decided on a 34 m2 Fantail-type sail, so I would need a spar of 10 meters, more or less.

    After reading Arne's article on mast scantlings I did some calculations. According to the "guess formula" my boat has a righting moment of roughly 1800 kpm. Using the ultimate tensile strength of steel[1] (400 MPa) and the spar base as the diameter (don't know if/how we should account for the pole being tapered?) I calculated[2] the breaking strength of the 188 mm mast to be 3238 kpm, which gives a "safety factor" of 1.8. With the 208 mm mast it would be 3982 kpm and a "safety factor" of 2.2.

    Weight is obviously a factor to consider. At 10 meters, the 188 mm mast would weigh roughly 90 kg while the 208 mm mast would weigh about 105 kg.

    So, the first question would be if 3 mm wall thickness is enough to use as a junk mast? The second question would be if the 188 mm pole is strong enough or if I should go with the 208 mm? I would preferrably avoid dismasting if possible.

    I think I know the answer already but I thought it'd be better to run it by you guys before I make any hasty decisions.

    [1] I guessed this to be the correct way to measure it, instead of using the yield strength
    [2] 40790000 * ((pi/32) * ((0.188^4-0.182^4)/0.188)= ~3238
    3238/1800= ~1.8
    40790000 * ((pi/32) * ((0.208^4-0.202^4)/0.208)= ~3982
    3982/1800= ~2.2
    Last modified: 17 Oct 2013 02:39 | Anonymous member
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