Good sailcloth for JR

  • 07 Feb 2017 20:32
    Reply # 4596460 on 1206989

    Jami, you need to bear in mind that the lighter the cloth, the shorter the working life of the sail. You were on the right track with 190gsm Outguard - this is the right weight for your sail, if you want to do something more than short leisure sails or races.

  • 07 Feb 2017 20:30
    Reply # 4596458 on 1206989
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Yes, yes, yes,

    that balloon stuff looks great, and at a decent price. I would go for it. It may be an idea to (later, when the sail and lazyjacks have found their place), to make a decent sail cover (UV and damp protection), similar to the one I have fitted, first to Broremann and now to Ingeborg.

    Arne

  • 07 Feb 2017 18:17
    Reply # 4596219 on 4595848
    Arne Kverneland wrote:

    Jami
    The sailcloth must be chosen to fit the size of the batten panels. You should rather aim for 100g/sqm (..and even 50...). Remember, each panel will only be about 2.1sqm. A 220g cloth will be reluctant to inflate in light winds.

    I just spoke to Ketil Greve (Check his X-99, Marie G). His present 7-panel sail is 55sqm and he uses spinnaker-cloth, in the 100g category, ot thereabouts. That works fine.

    Arne


    Something like this, then?

    Or rather this?

    Edit: This is very interesting - hot air balloon cloth, and costs almost nothing. Too bad the weight is round 89g/m2.
    Last modified: 07 Feb 2017 19:26 | Anonymous member
  • 07 Feb 2017 15:29
    Reply # 4595941 on 4595877
    Jeff Thompson wrote:

    While this topic is active, I wanted to inquire as to current opinion of Top Gun 9 (Mustang) and whether it is still considered a viable choice of cloth? I am working on drawing the second version of Fantail (23 meter) for my Paceship Amber. A local member and myself are still searching out a local,or at the very least Canadian supplier.

    I think the general preference now is for Weathermax 80, at this weight. But it's not necessary to go this heavy for a 23 sq m sail, Weathermax 65 would be enough. Top Gun 9 and Odyssey III have a high proportion of filler/ proofer, which we've found tends to break down/rub off in service. Only Top Gun 11 seems to give long service, and that's way too heavy for you.
  • 07 Feb 2017 15:24
    Reply # 4595936 on 4595615
    Jami Jokinen wrote:

    I'm going to use wide seatbelt-type webbing at the edges as suggested by Arne, which should be enough to keep flutter in control, I think.

    I'm more worried about the cloth itself, being 190 g/m2 compared to e.g. 275g/m2 of Top Gun or 220g/m2 of Odyssey III and Weathermax 65.

    190 gsm is absolutely fine for your size of boat. As it's 1.7m wide, and your sail is something a little under 3m wide, I would use vertical cloths, and use the excess width to form the tablings at luff and leech. Then, with the threadline parallel to the luff and leech, seatbelt webbing is entirely unnecessary. Seatbelt webbing is necessary when you make a panel out of one cloth, and the threadline is something like 10 degrees from the leech.

    The breakdown of cloth that I'm referring to happens within the area up to 200 - 300 mm from the leech, and it's due more to slow speed gentle flapping when reefed. It depends on how many miles you sail, whether you'll see this effect, but it's just as well to guard against it, as you have enough width of material to do so.

  • 07 Feb 2017 14:47
    Reply # 4595877 on 1206989
    Anonymous

    While this topic is active, I wanted to inquire as to current opinion of Top Gun 9 (Mustang) and whether it is still considered a viable choice of cloth? I am working on drawing the second version of Fantail (23 meter) for my Paceship Amber. A local member and myself are still searching out a local,or at the very least Canadian supplier.

    Last modified: 07 Feb 2017 14:50 | Anonymous
  • 07 Feb 2017 14:11
    Reply # 4595848 on 1206989
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Jami
    The sailcloth must be chosen to fit the size of the batten panels. You should rather aim for 100g/sqm (..and even 50...). Remember, each panel will only be about 2.1sqm. A 220g cloth will be reluctant to inflate in light winds.

    I just spoke to Ketil Greve (Check his X-99, Marie G). His present 7-panel sail is 55sqm and he uses spinnaker-cloth, in the 100g category, ot thereabouts. That works fine.

    I know, I know, it takes a bit time for a JR first-timer to realize that the stress in a junksail's cloth is an order of magnitude lower than in a gaff- or lugsail of the same size. It took me 3-4 years before it dawned to me.

    Arne


    Last modified: 07 Feb 2017 16:25 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 07 Feb 2017 10:08
    Reply # 4595615 on 1206989

    I'm going to use wide seatbelt-type webbing at the edges as suggested by Arne, which should be enough to keep flutter in control, I think.

    I'm more worried about the cloth itself, being 190 g/m2 compared to e.g. 275g/m2 of Top Gun or 220g/m2 of Odyssey III and Weathermax 65.

  • 07 Feb 2017 09:11
    Reply # 4595588 on 1206989

    It's certainly reasonable to put doublers where they are needed - which is not necessarily the whole of the top panel. I've found it to be good value to add a wider doubler up the length of the leech, because that's where a junk sail can tend to flutter and flap and break down, and the extra stiffness and weight slows this process. 

    The peak of the sail should have some extra patches, as this is where the vertical load is greatest. The throat should have some extra patches, as this is where there may be reversing loads across the bias of the cloth. It may be easier to do this by doubling the entire top panel, if you have spare cloth, but I wouldn't see it as essential.

  • 07 Feb 2017 08:44
    Reply # 4595563 on 1206989
    I'm trying to decide on the sailcloth for my about 17m2 JR.

    The european-made Swela Outguard (the lighter one, Outguard 190) seems a good and very affordable option, including my favourite colours. 

    I think the somewhat light 190 is sturdy enough for this size, even considering my fancy of rough weather.

    However, I wouldn't mind having a bit heavier upper panels. Outguard 230 is not an option (because of availability).

    Is it reasonable to put double cloth to upper panels? Does it work like it should (make the panels more rigid) or is it more of a problem shoud one cloth have a rip and let the wind inside a "bag"? 

       " ...there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in junk-rigged boats" 
                                                               - the Chinese Water Rat

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