Video: Russell Tall Ships Race 2020 and sheeting systems used

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  • 19 May 2020 01:09
    Reply # 8978167 on 8976031
    Anonymous wrote:

    Is there a similar event planned for 2021?

    Every year, first weekend after New Year.
  • 18 May 2020 02:44
    Reply # 8976031 on 8960889

    Is there a similar event planned for 2021?

  • 12 May 2020 10:34
    Reply # 8962865 on 8960889

    Zane wrote: "I am beginning to see you can have a variety of sheeting arrangements all with their own plus and minuses. " 

    That's exactly right, Zane. For cockpit sailing I prefer Arne's arrangement for the active end of the sheet (the end you hold in your hand). All that is required is un-ravelling the current ABCD route and you've got it in your hand. Job done. Nothing to lose. No tools required.  And if you don't like it you can easily put it back how it was.

    If you want the sheet to run by the hatch, then I am sure that bigger clutches will be a big improvement and will be 95% of what you can do to improve the situation. But asking a big soft rope to run freely out through a tube, even a slightly bigger tube, just doesn't appeal to me as being better than a cleat. You don't want to be having to feed it through.

    Each to their own.

    You should want to keep the big diameter sheet.


    Last modified: 18 May 2020 03:21 | Anonymous member
  • 12 May 2020 10:25
    Reply # 8962853 on 8962797
    Anonymous wrote:

    Hi, Zane,

    good to see your boat doing well. These boats of the Folkboat family like to be sailed on their ear. With their narrow beam and lots of ballast, the righting moment kicks in after 15-20° heel. In addition, the generous keel area keeps them from going sideways, even when heeling to 30°.

    The rig of your boat is quite similar to the one on my Ingeborg. I have used the ‘Johanna sheeting’ now, on five boats, as it has sufficient anti-twist in it for this sort of sail. On Ingeborg I have brought the hauling end of the sheet forward to the port genoa winch on the cockpit coaming (via one turning block). This 3-part sheet has very little friction in it, which is good when the sail goes up. The sheet force is on the high side, but I cope with that winch, if needed.

    A drawback with the Johanna-sheeting is that it requires a bit more space than I have, so I cannot sheet the furled bundle to the centreline. However, I can sheet in a deeply reefed sail for full close-hauled sailing, and that is good enough for me. The anti-twist properties of this sheeting has higher priority than sheeting to the centreline.

    The shown blocks in the top sheetlets should give way to those Barton rings.

    Arne




    Thanks Arne.  

    I am beginning to see you can have a variety of sheeting arrangements all with their own plus and minuses.  

    Will have to go view your pics of Ingeborg on site and put your words to a images so it makes better sense to me... 

  • 12 May 2020 10:09
    Reply # 8962802 on 8962799
    Anonymous wrote:
    Zane wrote:
    David wrote:

    I reckon that if the deflection is 10˚ or less, a block doesn't do anything useful. In this situation, I'd use Barton rings.

    Thanks mate. Looks like a few Barton ring number 60452's is what I need for my 10mm sheet.  Cheers!

    I'd go up to 60453 for more room for the sheet to go through fast, especially as it seems to be bigger than 10mm now.

    Good point.  As I just wrote, I purchased the supposedly correct size clutches for 10mm line .... the blinking line swells a bit, and now the clutches are useless and I have to swap 'em out to one's one size up.  So very good point, thanks David.

  • 12 May 2020 10:07
    Reply # 8962800 on 8962765
    Anonymous wrote:

    I can't answer your question Zane, and need not try now, anyway as other more experienced people have now chimed in. I'm glad to have raised the issue, because it really is unsatisfactory, but more than happy to bow out regarding the solution.

    I would say, if you want to follow David T's advice just start by changing to a smaller diameter sheet or get a bigger diameter clutch. That's where 90% of the problem lies I think. You really don't want to reduce the diameter of the sheet - not because of strength but more for comfort on your hands. I agree it is much nicer to have the sheet coming back towards you alongside the hatch. Its just that those big clutches are terribly expensive, the extra blocks at the mast do add a little to the friction, and it gives no mechanical advantage. Agreed, it is tidier and nicer - and I can imagine and believe it would be better for ocean sailing to be able to do everything from the hatch.

    Plenty of boats manage their sheets at the aft end of the cockpit and as you are not ocean cruising, you will be mainly sailing from the cockpit so what I suggested is cheaper and simpler and you can try it for yourself without irreversibly changing anything. I'd still do that first, just to see how you feel about it, nothing to lose. Dave W's variation of it is probably better, but that might mean re-arranging your sheeting system and that's OK but then you need someone like Paul or David W to help you do that.

    Everything on your boat is to a high standard and with the best of gear, so I suppose you will want to keep up the standard, go with David T's sheeting advice based on proven experience. I don't have deep pockets so in that case I think I would replace the clutch with a simple decent-sized cleat, at least for now. If you belay minimally, its just about as quick and easy to release. But that's just me. 




    Paul has swapped me some bigger diameter clutches......just the covid lockdown has prevented me from physically swapping them out -- so I'm really hoping that the bigger clutches is at least 4/5th of the 'rigor mortis' issue when I finally get round to changing them. 

    Though, the current clutches should have done the job.  Peeves me off.  I purchased the correct size clutches, and they indeed were a pretty penny.  Still, Pauls replacements are also top quality, with larger holes, so, as I say, when I swap 'em out, I'm hoping this will do the job without having to go down to 8mm sheet and halyard line- from 10.


  • 12 May 2020 10:06
    Reply # 8962799 on 8962656
    Zane wrote:
    David wrote:

    I reckon that if the deflection is 10˚ or less, a block doesn't do anything useful. In this situation, I'd use Barton rings.

    Thanks mate. Looks like a few Barton ring number 60452's is what I need for my 10mm sheet.  Cheers!

    I'd go up to 60453 for more room for the sheet to go through fast, especially as it seems to be bigger than 10mm now.
  • 12 May 2020 09:53
    Reply # 8962797 on 8960889
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Hi, Zane,

    good to see your boat doing well. These boats of the Folkboat family like to be sailed on their ear. With their narrow beam and lots of ballast, the righting moment kicks in after 15-20° heel. In addition, the generous keel area keeps them from going sideways, even when heeling to 30°.

    The rig of your boat is quite similar to the one on my Ingeborg. I have used the ‘Johanna sheeting’ now, on five boats, as it has sufficient anti-twist in it for this sort of sail. On Ingeborg I have brought the hauling end of the sheet forward to the port genoa winch on the cockpit coaming (via one turning block). This 3-part sheet has very little friction in it, which is good when the sail goes up. The sheet force is on the high side, but I cope with that winch, if needed.

    A drawback with the Johanna-sheeting is that it requires a bit more space than I have, so I cannot sheet the furled bundle to the centreline. However, I can sheet in a deeply reefed sail for full close-hauled sailing, and that is good enough for me. The anti-twist properties of this sheeting has higher priority than sheeting to the centreline.

    The shown blocks in the top sheetlets should give way to those Barton rings.

    Arne



  • 12 May 2020 09:47
    Reply # 8962765 on 8960889

    I can't answer your question Zane, and need not try now, anyway as other more experienced people have now chimed in. I'm glad to have raised the issue, because it really is unsatisfactory, but more than happy to bow out regarding the solution.

    I would say, if you want to follow David T's advice just start by changing to a smaller diameter sheet or get a bigger diameter clutch. That's where 90% of the problem lies I think. You really don't want to reduce the diameter of the sheet - not because of strength but more for comfort on your hands. I agree it is much nicer to have the sheet coming back towards you alongside the hatch. Its just that those big clutches are terribly expensive, the extra blocks at the mast do add a little to the friction, and it gives no mechanical advantage. Agreed, it is tidier and nicer - and I can imagine and believe it would be better for ocean sailing to be able to do everything from the hatch.

    Plenty of boats manage their sheets at the aft end of the cockpit and as you are not ocean cruising, you will be mainly sailing from the cockpit so what I suggested is cheaper and simpler and you can try it for yourself without irreversibly changing anything. I'd still do that first, just to see how you feel about it, nothing to lose. Dave W's variation of it might be better I don't know, but that might mean re-arranging your sheeting system and that's OK but then you need someone like Paul or David W to help you do that.

    Everything on your boat is to a high standard and with the best of gear, so I suppose you will want to keep up the standard, go with David T's sheeting advice based on proven experience. I don't have deep pockets so in that case I think I would replace the clutch with a simple decent-sized cleat, at least for now. If you belay minimally, its just about as quick and easy to release. But that's just me. 



    Last modified: 12 May 2020 10:08 | Anonymous member
  • 12 May 2020 09:20
    Reply # 8962723 on 8962697
    Anonymous wrote:

    Hi Zane.

    On Gypsy Rose the sheet is attached to the boom and the active part of the sheet comes from the block serving the upper sheetlets. I find that having the active part of the sheet at the top gives better control of the sail shape and causes less drag on the sheet. My sheet is made off at a cam cleat at the lower sheet block on the sheeting arch. I can either cleat it off on the cam cleat or run the tail to anywhere else that is convenient and make it fast there. This seems to work well and I have had no problems with friction or the sheet being unwilling to run out. I constructed an aluminium sheeting arch which keeps the sheets clear of the cockpit and provides a flat sheeting angle to the end of the main boom, this seems to work well.

    All the best, David.


    Thanks David, I have close ups on video of your boat at anchor, so will investigate.
    Don't have any during the TS race...you were too far ahead!

    Cheers.

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