A DIY face mask and other ways to fight the Corona virus

  • 28 Mar 2020 00:50
    Reply # 8863340 on 8855224
    Deleted user
    Increasing your resistance..... in other words enhancing your immune system, etc, is worth looking into.   Doctor Joseph Feuerstein

    offers a number of brief and often interesting talks on his website, nearly all of which are based on interesting medical studies.   It makes interesting reading.  One that might apply here is with regard to American Ginseng, and it's ability to boost resistance to respiratory illnesses.  The two studies were done in a nursing home on older patients (average 80).    The results were quite dramatic in both studies.  These are 20 year old studies.   This may or may not apply here, but it seems like cheap insurance, as this may be purchased in bulk online.   There are a number of large producers in Wisconsin.    Draw your own conclusions.  As a disclaimer Dr. Joe currently has Covid 19, the result of working in the ER, but seems to be coming through it quite well.   

         Another thing I ran across which is specific to corona viruses..... and I do not have a link saved, was a lab study on individual cells and corona viruses.  It was discovered that increasing the zinc  level within the cellular cytoplasm, greatly inhibited the ability of the virus to inject it's DNA successfully into a cell, and get that cell to produce more virus.... which is the way viruses work more or less.    The problem with this is that you cannot elevate cellular zinc beyond the "normal" level,  however if you for any reason might have a zinc deficiency, it could make you  more vulnerable.    Zinc is a mineral that is water soluble, and the danger of overdosing is virtually non existent as a result.

         In  general, I think good health, a balanced diet, adequate exercise, and a keeping stress low are important.  The ability of your immune system to ramp up fast enough to bring this under control before it can do a lot of damage is critical.  Lung damage in even mild cases is serious, and possibly irreversible.    This thing is no joke!!  And I get angry when I hear idiots compare it to flu.   Here in the US, the number of cases is nearly doubling every 2 days........ the worst of any country.  I'm not horribly afraid of death itself,  just of the process of getting there.   

         My own thinking on this is that hand washing is of course important, because few of us can resist touching our faces for some reason ..... excellent advice!   I would choose to breath through my mouth when in the vicinity of "infection potential" simply because the nose and eyes are the primary points of entry  rather than the mouth.  I presume the environment in the mouth is less susceptible for various reasons, while  moist respiratory tissues of the nose are more susceptible.   It infects the nasal and respiratory passages, not the gut........... Perhaps shallow mouth breathing, with periodic alcohol rinses.   Deep mouth breaths of course are more likely to take it directly to the esophagus and lungs, while the hairs and mucus in the nasal passages are natural "landings", designed to trap stuff.... but also prime infection sites apparently.  It appears to progress from the nose and sinus passages where it reproduces easily downward into the lungs.  

         Protecting others is at least as important as protecting yourself.......... and that is where masks would seem to come into their own.   Going to Costco to stock up Tuesday, I went during "senior hour"   (60+).  I was shocked at the line waiting for the store to open, and the crowds inside, many wearing  masks, and all respecting separation space. Shelves were well stocked... first thing in the AM.... and people were in good spirits.  Carts were piled high.......... but that's understandable.  The less you expose yourself the safer for yourself and friends.  My work qualifies as "vital", so I do not expect to be shut down.  Thankfully it does not entail significant contact with. I saw exactly  people  the last 24 hours, all of us acutely aware of the situation.  

                                                                                    H.W.


                                      

  • 28 Mar 2020 00:43
    Reply # 8863335 on 8862998
    Deleted user
    Anonymous wrote:

    I would agree with Darren to this extent: the surgical mask does not provide anything like 100% protection for yourself – better masks and suits are needed for that. Social (ie physical) distancing and hygiene are the most important forms of self-protection. But if you must go out, ie to buy food, using a mask will help reduce the risk of spreading the virus.

    This post ended up longer than intended, if you want the short entertaining version, just watch this video, wash your hands A LOT, and don't wear a mask.

    If we want to slow down the spread of coronavirus is important to understand how it spreads and what works to slow the spread.   I think most folks don't understand how masks and gloves work, why they work in hospitals and why having the general public wear them is not a good idea.

    Masks and gloves are useful if you have to be within a metre of other people and have a large supply of them that you can change often.  They are a temporary barrier, if they are used for an extended period of time they become a source of contamination.  It takes time to become accustomed to wearing a mask and it takes a lot of discipline to use it correctly.  There are lots of ways that a mask can make things worse.  Here in BC we have organised COVID-19 patients to discrete care sites.  One of the reasons is so that healthcare personal can keep their protective gear on for longer, because each time you remove or adjust protective gear you are at increased risk of getting the virus.  Getting your hands near your face is one of the worst things you can do.  Doctors and nurses practice a regime of donning and removing protective gear that helps minimise this risk.  However, here and in many other places they are now breaking one of the fundamental rules about protective gear.  Protective gear should be changed often, however here and in much of the world healthcare workers now have to leave it on for longer because they are having to ration it.  The proper way to use the gear is to scrub up outside a patients room, don the protective gear (gloves and mask or more), examine the patient, leave the room, remove gloves, remove mask with hands that just come from the inside of clean gloves, scrub everything again anyway.

    Meanwhile, if you go into public you'll see folks pull a mask down to their chin to talk or have break breathing more easily, you'll see them regularly adjust their mask with contaminated hands, people will remove and then reuse mask, ........  the list is very long of the errors being made.  Once you touch your mask with contaminated hands, the mask is a pretty good environment to harbour the virus and help spread it to your susceptible mucous tissues.  I see many people using their hands to repeatedly pull their collar up over their mouth when it falls down.  This is insane, your hands are the dirty contaminated part and now you have just transferred what's on them to the scarf to be repeatedly rubbed into your nose and mouth.   

    All of this is not necessary because the main mode of spread of coronavirus is your hands and people grossly underestimate how contaminated their hands are, how often they touch their hands to their eyes, mouth and nose.  If you think you wash your hands enough and don't touch your face you're wrong.  I know we don't like to hear this in and age when we are all special flowers and Amazon brings us whatever we want the next day, but you don't wash your hands well enough and you touch your face way more often than you think.  I challenge you to record a video of yourself doing some work, something like reading, typing at the computer etc.  You will touch your face and not even be aware of it.  Even now people don't wash their hands well enough.  They use too little soap, don't wash them for long enough, don't wash far enough up their wrists, or touch something that is contaminated right after washing their hands.  If you wash your hands, but don't sanitise your phone immediately afterwards you may as well have not washed your hands.  Same for your car keys, etc.    For those of you that don't want to record yourselves, watch this video.  Unfortunately, it is no different with adults than it is with kids.  Imagine if you put the glow powder on the hands of a grocery clerk doing stocking, before he left his house.

    Rather than wearing a mask, deal with contaminated surfaces and hands, this is where you are going to get coronavirus unless you're unlucky enough to have someone sneezing right in your face.  For those rare times you have to go out for groceries etc.  Keep your hands in your pockets.  Don't touch any public surfaces that you don't have to.  If you do touch a surface clean your hands as soon as possible, the clock is ticking and you will touch your face unconsciously.  Almost all of your groceries could have corona on them.  You wash your fruits and vegetables so they're fine.  I wipe down every bag, jug, bottle etc. with a soapy cloth or a sterilizing wipe if I can't get soapy water.  If you get a package, let it sit for a day or two before tearing it open, the virus doesn't live that long on most surface.

    Wearing a mask provides a false sense of security, it makes you more likely to touch your face, which is a far greater risk than airborne corona, there is a worlwide shortage of high quality masks.  If you have high quality masks bring them to a nearby hospital after calling ahead to find the best way to deliver them.   This week New York city went searching worldwide to try and find masks for their medical personnel.

    Masks make people feel better.  Politicians live in fear of people not feeling better, otherwise the cry to stop wearing masks would be even louder.  

  • 27 Mar 2020 23:58
    Reply # 8863269 on 8855224
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Arne wrote: My motif (motive) was mainly to protect the surroundings from me (in case I were infected without knowing). 

    Arne is right.

    And the latest figures here regarding supplies for front line workers: (The Director General of Health) stated that "Ministry of Health reserves and DHBs had 1.9 million aprons or gowns, 2.7 million pairs of gloves, 60,000 goggles and five million masks. The ministry also had 18 million masks in its national supply, 640,000 of which were sent out to DHBs yesterday".

    Which means we are pretty lucky (so far) in this little country (with credit to some very good leadership.)


    Last modified: 28 Mar 2020 00:08 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 27 Mar 2020 23:42
    Reply # 8863230 on 8855224
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Darren,
    I struggle with understanding the reasons for your warnings against  wearing home-made masks. They may fit in your place, but not here.

    1.      You are afraid that the proper surgical masks will not reach hospitals because we, the ordinary people will buy all of them.
    That will at least not happen here, as surgical masks have been reserved for the hospitals a good while ago, so if we want a mask, we all have to make them, simple as that. (Now I see on the TV that a plane just landed in Norway with a load of six million facemasks plus half a million of protective coats, and so on, from China. That is like having 400 million sent to the US).

    2.      As for the efficiency of the home-made masks, I had my doubts as well. My motive was mainly to protect the surroundings from me (in case I were infected without knowing). I only wear that mask inside my local Coop, which I only visit for 20 minutes, once a week. The thing is that my local shop is not big, and the 2-metre distance can be difficult to keep there, at all times. The mask has been ironed and is pretty clean when I don it, outside the shop. Then David Tyler showed us the link to a test of different DIY-friendly tissues for masks. The Cambridge university found that a doubled dish towel was as good as anything, if a little hard to breath through. That is what I use now. I manage well for those 20 minutes.

    So, to conclude,

    1.      I don’t inspire people to prevent hospitals from getting any masks, since they are not available here.

    2.      The mask I wear for those 20 minutes a week is perfectly clean as I enter the Coop.

    3.      My re-use of the mask after ironing it (steam iron) is in my view better than having a stack of use-and throw masks. After my latest update, I think it fits pretty well and need no touching.

    4.      And yes, I have just about isolated myself. I take a walk along the street once a day, but we all are serious here and keep a distance (...I would say we keep a distance with a smile, a wave, and sometimes a few cheer-up words, as we pass each other...).

    Sooo...

    Cheers, and cheer up, my friends!

    Arne



    Last modified: 28 Mar 2020 00:10 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 27 Mar 2020 22:52
    Reply # 8863151 on 8855224

    Hi All,

    A few thoughts on helping to curb the progress of the virus...

    The thread is called ..A DIY mask and other ways to fight the C-19... There's a brilliant brand new app now available in the UK, and soon to be launched worldwide, called the Covid-19 Symptom Tracker. https://covid.joinzoe.com/  Once on your device, it will convey how you feel every day (well or otherwise) to the people who can crunch this info and make it useful for policy, health pros etc. Information getting to the right people is vital in the fight against the virus. The app has had 1.5 million downloads since TUESDAY,  half a million a day. It HAS had some techy glitches: it is a non-profit initiative headed by Tim Spector, Kings College, London, along with health authorities etc. etc. So the tech side has been tricky for them. My experience has been (on my android phone) to enter all your details WITHOUT using auto-fill, when signing up, DONT forget your password as there's no password reminder facility yet, and if you find the page is disappearing behind your keyboard just tap the last line of script you can see and it'll scroll up. Many of you will know theses little hacks so forgive me for stating the obvious. If you just get a blank screen at any time, even after signing up and sending your first "report" (it takes SECONDS!) , try restarting the device. It worked for me... However many are giving it poor reviews, even though they are clearly public spirited and interested folk. The web site's advice is that they are constantly working on it, it has only been up since Tuesday, and to keep trying.

    Of concern is that the app is not well-known or being taken up by people over 60 i.e. those most at risk, so tell all your wrinkly chums and get onto it yourself if you possibly can. Information getting to the right people is really important, whether you are ill or not.  https://covid.joinzoe.com/

    Very interesting discussion above. I'm definitely supporting the use of a mask of some sort. My rather large 3M rubber-faced respirator is a bit over the top I think, and from what many are saying a much lower tech, less "scaring" option is preferable - the Buff or scarf, polo-neck jumper pulled up or whatever, backed up by kitchen towel. All of these need to washable of course, between every use, or disposed of very carefully. The real thing should be kept for use by those on the front lines.

    My Amanda gave me a yoga session last birthday. She is a serious operator in T'ai chi and qi gong See, I don't even know how to write it :( At 57 with much more grey hair than I deserve, I was definitely the odd one out. But I was absolutely bitten by the benefits. It is mostly Hatha yoga which I think is quite active. The classes have of course folded for now, but I do a session every few days at home. But seeing David's exhortation to keep fit and ready for the boat when we are able to carry on, I thought I'd mention yoga. It shouldn't be too airy-fairy, but not too stretching at first either. Don't push it, just enjoy regaining flexibility and suffering fewer aches and pains getting the shopping out of the car or even hauling your anchor over a pushpit (or is it a pullpit - we don't have one). There must be heaps of yoga stuff online.

    Look up https://covid.joinzoe.com/

    Stay well, and keep an eye on the horizon. Surely it is coming closer?!

    Pol.


  • 27 Mar 2020 21:00
    Reply # 8862998 on 8855224
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Darren wrote: Everyone needs to stop wearing masks.

    I can read the passion and sincerity in this appeal, but with respect, I have to disagree.

    Firstly, in respect to the argument that hospitals need them more: in my country wholesale pharmacy supplies are allocated in such a way that hospitals have first priority, which is one of the reasons why they have been available to the public only intermittently in recent times. This is how it should be, and in anticipation of a shortage I thought it might be wise to spend a little time and see if it might be possible to find an alternative to the surgical masks which people in Asian countries have been using for years now during outbreaks of influenza etc. People are not going to stop wearing masks.

    Actually, I have a small stock of surgical masks which were imported for me by a friend, some time ago. I am not using them at present, and thinking now that if a greater need arises elsewhere I may well donate them as I may not need them much. My strategy (far more effective) is to stay at home and isolate myself from other people. Not all people are so fortunate. My daughter is on the front line at the main airport, at border control.

    When going outside, I think everyone has a social responsibility to mask themselves in any way they can, in order to reduce the chances of spreading the virus to others. The paradigm is: assume you have it already. I am not sure how effective the Arne-type mask would be, and have no idea of what evidence Darren might have in saying most DIY masks are not effective. Common sense would suggest that a home-made mask might not be quite as good as a manufactured surgical mask, but much better than nothing, and commendably Arne’s suggestion does not take surgical masks away from the front line workers.

    I would agree with Darren to this extent: the surgical mask does not provide anything like 100% protection for yourself – better masks and suits are needed for that. Social (ie physical) distancing and hygiene are the most important forms of self-protection. But if you must go out, ie to buy food, using a mask will help reduce the risk of spreading the virus.

    PS I just read Annie's post. I am in a similar situation to Annie. We are the lucky ones. My thoughts and best wishes go out to all the others around the world who are not so lucky.

    Last modified: 27 Mar 2020 21:04 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 27 Mar 2020 20:46
    Reply # 8862972 on 8855224

    In NZ, we have substituted the phrase "physical distancing" for "social distancing"; a sensible move which more accurately suggests what is required.  There are a couple of dozen of us locked down in the boatyard here.  We see one another regularly, always ask "Are you OK?", but stay in our "bubbles".  We singletons have been encouraged to share our bubble with one other for mutual support.  My bubble mate is Shirley. 

    For those of us used to being on our own and with plenty to do, this lockdown is no hardship.  I found my mind in "voyaging mode" and have had to keep reminding myself that I have plenty of water!

    Darren is quite right.  if we rigorously observe physical distancing, we are minimising the risk both to ourselves and others.  The risks are very real to the vulnerable; on the other hand, most of us will probably not even realise that we caught the virus,  so consider others first and carry on enjoying those good things in life that are still available.  I have warm sun shining on me at present.  And as so many people are pointing out: our parents and grandparents were told to kill an be killed; all that we are being asked to so is stay at home.

    Keep well, everyone and keep up the interesting conversations :-)

  • 27 Mar 2020 19:26
    Reply # 8862771 on 8855224
    Deleted user

    Please don't make a mask and wear it.  There are a lot of reasons for this, but mostly, you are going to cause more harm than do good.  Everyone needs to stop wearing masks.  Even if you make your own mask, wearing it encourages others to wear masks and the vast majority of those folks won't be making their own, they'll be taking ones that are much better used in hospitals.

    The coarse droplets that spread Coronavirus don't spread far.  If you use social distancing and wash your hands, you are not going to significantly reduce your risk by wearing a home-made mask (especially since most home-made masks are not effective).  However, wearing any kind of mask encourages others to do the same and that means fewer masks for hospitals and care-givers.  They deserve to have protective equipment to protect themselves.  On the few occasions I've gone out lately I've seen too many people misusing masks.  You see people adjust them frequently, pull them down to speak, leave wide gaps around the mask and I bet most don't dispose of or treat them like a biohazard material as soon as they are removed.  Many folks are probably increasing their risk of getting Coronavirus by wearing a mask. 

    The hospitals are strained enough right now without losing health-care workers because they don't have enough protective gear.  Arne, please understand I have an immense amount of respect for your ingenuity and the generosity with which you share it, but I've spoken out because I feel there is a real potential to do harm here.

  • 26 Mar 2020 16:29
    Reply # 8860278 on 8855224
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    New version.

    Now I have edited my facemask write-up. I have added a one-page appendix to the original text. You may, or may not find it useful.

    Cheers, everybody  -  I hope you are all fine!
    Arne


    Last modified: 27 Mar 2020 08:27 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 26 Mar 2020 04:46
    Reply # 8859543 on 8855224

    hi gary

    Gary Pick wrote:

    From a mate who works with infectious diseases in animals, fabric facemasks can via moisture in the mask create a wick for infection…

    that's what arne fights by ironing his mask.

    …Also the weave of the material is rarely dense enough...his analogy is like trying to keep out mosquitoes with chicken wire.

    well, around 99% might be held back by avoiding to spread drops of water – here 'chicken wire' may be good enough…

    ueli

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