Pondering Seablossom's rig

  • 29 Oct 2011 09:06
    Reply # 736869 on 726309
    Do a bit of checking on your double-sided (basting) tape.  Some are more powerful than others and some are so sticky that they gum up your needles.

    Try, if you can, to have a nice slippery surface under the sailcloth.  It might be worth setting the whole lot out on one of those so-often-mentioned polytarps.  Walking feet are great because they help push the fabric along.  They struggle if you have a rough surface for the material to move over.  Ergo, even without a walking foot, if the rest of the sail bundle can move easily, it will be much less effort to push things through.

    I have a Brother machine and used it to make my sail cover, which is a patchwork of Top Gun bits that Paul scraped together for me.  The machine had no problems at all with this much heavier material and Odyssey would be a shoo-in.

    Sailmaking is fun.  It's a nice clean job, done indoors with no dust, no smell and an accommodating little machine that only asks for a sharp needle and a frequently swept-out bobbin case.
  • 29 Oct 2011 00:06
    Reply # 736488 on 726309
    Deleted user
    I will confirm that Rochford Supply is where I got my Odyssey III, and sure had better prices than any place else.

    I did my sewing with a combination of two machines, one a fairly powerful non-walking foot machine, and the other an AlphaSew knockoff of the Sailrite LSZ-1.  Having done this, plus taken a look at a Sailrite.  Here are some thoughts for you:

    1.  The AlphaSew was a somewhat cruder machine than the SailRite, which isn't exactly an elegant piece of machinery to start out with.  But I got the use of it loaned to me at no charge, and that is hard to beat!

    2.  Without the walking foot, it takes a good bit of effort and practice to sew with a vaguely even stitch length on big (panel sized) pieces of Odyssey III.

    3.  Despite this, I doubt my sails are going to fall apart from my bad stitching.

    4.  Using basting tape (ordered from sailrite) made sewing (for this novice) unbelievably more pleasant.

    Have fun once you are done working on the iron topsail!

    Barry
  • 28 Oct 2011 20:27
    Reply # 736311 on 736143
    Jeff McFadden wrote:
    I'll be sewing with a cheapo Brother machine that I bought at Walmart. I sewed the sail for The Brunk with it out of blue polytarp, so it seems like it should handle the Odyssey III. I hope. Seablossom has definitely made me believe the old saw that BOAT is an acronym for Break Out Another Thousand; I don't really want a Sailrite sewing machine no matter how wonderful they are.
    It never occurred to me that I could wind bobbins and sew at the same time. Somehow I see myself so tangled up in thread that I have to call for an emergency extraction. I've got maybe half a dozen or so bobbins; I just wind the whole bunch and sew 'til they're gone. Chicken as I am I may just stay with that plan.
    Hi Jeff, never meant to imply that you need a Sailrite machine. They are great machines but the one that you have most likely will work just fine. Polytarp is however easier to sew than Odyssey. The important point with Odyssey. is lots of foot pressure (at least with my machine) and without a walking foot, a strong left arm will help remedy that defect :-)

    Automatic bobbin winding  as done with commercial machines is a simple add on (the Sailrites built in bobbin winder is pathetic) but since you are only planning to make one large sail, it just means you will have to stop every once in a while and rewind your bobbins. A pain but not a problem.

    Do however use black thread if you have it as it's UV resistance is the best.

    BTW, I will upload dimensioned drawings (pdf format) of your sail and spars over the next week or so. However anything not complete on the 7th, Nov will have to wait until I am back from my visit to Annie and David (12th Nov).
  • 28 Oct 2011 19:46
    Reply # 736285 on 736143
    Jeff McFadden wrote:
    Annie Hill wrote:
    I've got maybe half a dozen or so bobbins; I just wind the whole bunch and sew 'til they're gone. 
    That's what I do. A professional may need to save a minute or two. I'm glad of the chance to rest my eyes from concentrating on sewing straight, whilst I  rewind my bobbins.
  • 28 Oct 2011 17:03
    Reply # 736143 on 734966
    Deleted user
    Annie Hill wrote:Buy two large spools and a automatic bobbin winder so that you can rewind your bobbin as you sew,

    Actually, you don't really need an extra bobbin winder because the built-in one will work while you are sewing.  Normally one uses the clutch so that the needle doesn't belt away and get entangled in the thread on the lower bobbin, but if you are actually sewing, you can rewind as you go as long as you have two spools of thread.  These spools are BIG and what you need is a lead from above both the machine and the spool to take the thread off the top of the spool.  One can be readily fabricated from a wire coat hanger.

    The latest advice I have had is to use American and Efird Inc's Sunstop UV, jet black for sewing.  It is supposed to have a very extended life of up to 10 years.  Yeah, right.

    But it ought to - it costs enough!

    Hmmm. Well, I've fabricated a thread feeder, and I do have a whole spool of the non-Teflon thread you recommend, but I'm pretty sure I don't have a second spool of thread. It's been a while now since I looked.
    I'll be sewing with a cheapo Brother machine that I bought at Walmart. I sewed the sail for The Brunk with it out of blue polytarp, so it seems like it should handle the Odyssey III. I hope. Seablossom has definitely made me believe the old saw that BOAT is an acronym for Break Out Another Thousand; I don't really want a Sailrite sewing machine no matter how wonderful they are.
    It never occurred to me that I could wind bobbins and sew at the same time. Somehow I see myself so tangled up in thread that I have to call for an emergency extraction. I've got maybe half a dozen or so bobbins; I just wind the whole bunch and sew 'til they're gone. Chicken as I am I may just stay with that plan.
  • 27 Oct 2011 21:02
    Reply # 734966 on 726309
    Buy two large spools and a automatic bobbin winder so that you can rewind your bobbin as you sew,

    Actually, you don't really need an extra bobbin winder because the built-in one will work while you are sewing.  Normally one uses the clutch so that the needle doesn't belt away and get entangled in the thread on the lower bobbin, but if you are actually sewing, you can rewind as you go as long as you have two spools of thread.  These spools are BIG and what you need is a lead from above both the machine and the spool to take the thread off the top of the spool.  One can be readily fabricated from a wire coat hanger.

    The latest advice I have had is to use American and Efird Inc's Sunstop UV, jet black for sewing.  It is supposed to have a very extended life of up to 10 years.  Yeah, right.

    But it ought to - it costs enough!
  • 26 Oct 2011 19:54
    Reply # 733850 on 733718
    Jeff McFadden wrote:Makes perfect sense to me.  Not to mention that Odyssey III costs much less than Top Gun.
    And Rochford Supply is so much cheaper than Sailrite that I could hardly believe it, and carries more colors, including the two colors I'm having a hard time choosing between, too.
    The only reason I asked is that Sailrite showed a much longer expected life span for Top Gun than for Odyssey.  I suppose that is exposed to UV full time, though, and not an issue as long as one has / uses sail covers.
    Jeff, Sailrite is a great place for specialist items or if you just want a small amount of something. There Sailrite LZ1 walking foot machine is the best sailmaking machine for the money that I know of but generally speaking, once I've located what I want on there website, I google around to see if I can get the item at a better price. Often a better price is available but many times, Sailrite is more convenient and not always that much more expensive. However for Odyssey or Top Gun, Rochford has no competition.

    The other plus for Sailrite is if you do not really understand enough to be sure the the quality/spec of whatever you are looking for is correct, Sailrite give good advise and have (mostly) quality products. Of cause once I've asked and received advise from them, I generally feel obliged to buy.

    As to sail life, you want to cover the sail anyway even if just to keep it clean. It's not the life of the Odyssey that you need to worry about, it's the thread. You will probably have to restitch the sail two or three times before you hit the end of the Odyssey's life span.

    BTW, avoid the Teflon based threads, they may last forever but they are absolute hell to sew with and will cause endless aggravation with missed stitches and the like. Just use the highest quality V96 sailmakers thread that you can get. Sailrite is a good source for that. Buy two large spools and a automatic bobbin winder so that you can rewind your bobbin as you sew, Otherwise you will be forever stopping to rewind your bobbin and it gets most aggravating after a few times.
  • 26 Oct 2011 17:14
    Reply # 733718 on 733265
    Deleted user
    Paul Thompson wrote:
    Jeff McFadden wrote:
    Just wondering: why Odyssey III rather than Top Gun?

    Jeff,

    Top Gun is much to heavy for such a small sail at about 11oz per yard. Using it would be complete over kill and it would completely destroy your light air performance as you would need a fairly strong breeze just to get it to fill out and take it's shape. Since you are going to be sailing inland light air performance is very important.

    The lighter Odyssey (about 6-7oz) is also much easier to handle for both sewing and for the finished product. It is a slightly stretchy material which also is what you need if you are building a sail using Arne's methods. Odyssey is also significantly cheaper than Top Gun. If you still have any doubts, check with Annie, we built her sail from Odyssey and I believe that she is very happy with it. Arne has also told me that he would be happy to use it for Johanna's sail if he were to make one for her today. Lastly, I eat my own dogfood and La Chica's sails are made from Odyssey as well.

    I used Top Gun for Carl Bosteks Aphrodite, but Aphrodite is a very heavy boat.  Odyssey would have been too light for her. 

    To the best of my knowledge, Rochford Supply is the best source of Odyssey in the USA if you are looking for a source.
    Makes perfect sense to me.  Not to mention that Odyssey III costs much less than Top Gun.
    And Rochford Supply is so much cheaper than Sailrite that I could hardly believe it, and carries more colors, including the two colors I'm having a hard time choosing between, too.
    The only reason I asked is that Sailrite showed a much longer expected life span for Top Gun than for Odyssey.  I suppose that is exposed to UV full time, though, and not an issue as long as one has / uses sail covers.
  • 26 Oct 2011 02:57
    Reply # 733272 on 733246
    Deleted user
    Jeff McFadden wrote:
    Paul Thompson wrote:
    Jeff McFadden wrote:
    That is going to work, I feel quite confident.

    Ok then Jeff, I'll finalize the drawing and do the specs for you you. I suggest that you build the sail from Odyssey III and you use aluminum for battens and yard. I will post the complete specs for the yard and battens and all the needed drawings to your Seablossem folder when done.

    Just wondering: why Odyssey III rather than Top Gun?

    Perhaps because Odyssey is 6.5oz./yd. and Top Gun is 11oz./yd. ?
  • 26 Oct 2011 02:50
    Reply # 733265 on 733246
    Jeff McFadden wrote:
    Just wondering: why Odyssey III rather than Top Gun?

    Jeff,

    Top Gun is much to heavy for such a small sail at about 11oz per yard. Using it would be complete over kill and it would completely destroy your light air performance as you would need a fairly strong breeze just to get it to fill out and take it's shape. Since you are going to be sailing inland light air performance is very important.

    The lighter Odyssey (about 6-7oz) is also much easier to handle for both sewing and for the finished product. It is a slightly stretchy material which also is what you need if you are building a sail using Arne's methods. Odyssey is also significantly cheaper than Top Gun. If you still have any doubts, check with Annie, we built her sail from Odyssey and I believe that she is very happy with it. Arne has also told me that he would be happy to use it for Johanna's sail if he were to make one for her today. Lastly, I eat my own dogfood and La Chica's sails are made from Odyssey as well.

    I used Top Gun for Carl Bosteks Aphrodite, but Aphrodite is a very heavy boat.  Odyssey would have been too light for her. 

    To the best of my knowledge, Rochford Supply is the best source of Odyssey in the USA if you are looking for a source.
    Last modified: 26 Oct 2011 04:06 | Anonymous member
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