Ingeborg, Arne's Marieholm IF

  • 07 Jun 2017 14:19
    Reply # 4885099 on 4885079
    Anonymous member (Administrator)
    Mark Case wrote:

    It works, and very stately she looks too...  No doubt who the real star is in that video.

    A quick question - what is the line that looks like a mini kicking strap?

    Congratulations, Arne!


    Mark


    That line (with the rubber snubber on it) is actually the tack line, TL. By attaching it a bit aft of the mast, it ensures the boom will not be pulled aft. No big kicking strap effect from it, but on Ingeborg, the boom is actually built a bit stouter, to the same dimension as the two upper battens (50 x 1.5mm). This is to help the Fan Up Preventer (FUP) work well without bending the boom. The FUP is not yet on.

    Before that very outing I shortened the TL 10cm to bring the boom a little lower. That appears to not be the smartest move. As you can see on some of the photos, both the topping lift and the mast lift cut into the lowest panel. Better let the boom rise a little, so before next trip I will adjust the TL back to the previous setting.

    Arne

  • 07 Jun 2017 13:56
    Reply # 4885079 on 3032430

    It works, and very stately she looks too...  No doubt who the real star is in that video.

    A quick question - what is the line that looks like a mini kicking strap?

    Congratulations, Arne!


    Mark

  • 07 Jun 2017 13:44
    Reply # 4885061 on 3032430
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Here is a link to a 40second/57MB video clip showing Ingeborg sailing. No Oscar for either the actor or cameraman, but at least you ca see how she looks. Ingeborg is steering herself during the first part of the clip, until I undo the tiller lock and alter course.

    I guess you can play the clip directly, but it will have higher resolution if you download the file, and then play it on your device.
    Now, let's see if it works...

    Arne

  • 07 Jun 2017 10:00
    Reply # 4884828 on 3032430
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Annie,

    maybe I have grown to be a half-decent helmsman after all these years, but I think it is more the boat than the man this time. When I had Johanna, I sailed a couple of times in company with a Nordic Folkboat. When close-hauled, the same thing happened: The Folkboat sailed 2-4° (I just guess) higher, while Johanna drifted to leeward.

    Last year, during the first trial sails of Ingeborg, she went well, but not that well. Then I thought that I would have a hard time with keeping up with that Folkboat. I must have under-estimated the effect of the moderately foul bottom she had then. Now, after slipping, she really flies in light winds so I guess she and the Folkboat will be quite equal.

    My reasoning behind choosing an IF as a JR project was that I knew about their pointing ability. All they needed was a bigger rig for light winds to overcome the higher wetted surface. Ingeborg’s JR area is the same as the IF with Genoa 1, so is not extreme in any way.

    There is another thing to consider  -  the sheeting and twist.
    Ingeborg has been given the same ‘Johanna sheeting’ as my previous boats (see
    Junk Rig for Beginners, p.5). This has a very good anti-twist effect. As can be seen on the photos, there is just that little bit twist in her sail, both when sailing upwind and downwind. In fact, when sailing close-hauled, with full sail set, I use to monitor the leech telltale of the upper panel. This indicates separation a moment before the others. Keeping the whole sail working, is in my view important to get the best out of a sail.
    The Johanna sheeting takes up quite some room so if there simply is not enough of it, I would split the sheet in an upper and lower part. I think one would be paid back handsomely in performance for the extra complexity of handling two sheet tails, in particular when the sail is reefed.

    Arne

    On the photo below you can see how I tame the long sheet bundle on Ingeborg: A rope loop is lying ready on the side deck so as soon as the sail has been dropped, I clip it around the bundle.


    Photo section 5

    Last modified: 05 Jul 2025 23:04 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 06 Jun 2017 22:03
    Reply # 4883960 on 3032430

    Gorgeous boat, and great skill in getting her there! Beautiful photos, and just see those tell-tales fly! Thanks Arne!

    Pol.

  • 06 Jun 2017 21:53
    Reply # 4883919 on 4883682
    Arne Kverneland wrote: 



     Still, we gained on her quite easily and soon we were about to overtake her, when we split up.

    I've had that happen to me - some people really don't like being overtaken by a junk!

    The Marieholm IF,

    together with a 35sqm cambered panel JR,
    plus fresh antifouling
      -
     is a seriously good combination.


    Arne, my friend, I do believe you have forgotten one very important part of the equations: + with Arne on the helm!
  • 06 Jun 2017 20:30
    Reply # 4883725 on 3032430
    Deleted user

    I have to say, Arne, that she is one of the most beautiful, practical, and elegant boats I've seen.

  • 06 Jun 2017 20:01
    Reply # 4883682 on 3032430
    Anonymous member (Administrator)
     



     

    Typical!

    During all the years I had my Alo 28, Johanna, I hardly spotted another Alo. Only yesterday, as I and a mate had just taken out Ingeborg for a spin, did an Alo pass us in the opposite direction. She was tacking her way upwind and that was simply an irresistible temptation to us, so we turned around. The Alo already had over 100m lead. Still, we gained on her quite easily and soon we were about to overtake her, when we split up. It appeared that the speed through the water was very similar (between 4 and 5 kts, wind about F3), but Ingeborg simply tacked well inside the other boat. I roughly assessed the difference in pointing angle to be between 3 and 5°. The Alo was simply drifting to leeward. So what was wrong with her then? Nothing I could spot. The sails were not old rags  -  quite the opposite: The mainsail was a tri-radial, full-length-batten job, no less, and the jib was one of these tall narrow 100% jibs, perfectly suited for the job that day. The whole ship looked very smart.

    I put this observation in the heap of hints I have got recently, and I dare conclude now:

    The Marieholm IF,
    together with a 35sqm cambered panel JR,
    plus fresh antifouling
      -
     is a seriously good combination.

    Cheers, Arne

    PS:
    Before we went back to the berth, my crew jumped ashore with my camera. With me scooting back and forth on the bay, he took over fifty photos, plus a little video clip. Here are a few of them.

      


  • 01 Jun 2017 23:08
    Reply # 4875534 on 3032430
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Sailing Ingeborg, now with fresh antifouling

    Today I and a friend had a 3-4-hour spin in Ingeborg, only two weeks after she got her new antifouling. The wind was around 8 and up to 10kts from around west.

    The setting of the sail:
    To begin with I wasn’t completely happy with it, but it turned out to set better and better the more I sailed, and without me tweaking the parrels. When arriving at home, I could no longer tell which way I should have adjusted the parrels, the YHP, THP or HKPs, so I guess they were ok.

    Speed:
    Ingeborg is clearly a different
     and much faster animal now than she was on my trial sails last year. I am particularly impressed with her upwind performance. I checked her tacks on the GPS, and even there, after leeway, did the tacking angle stay around 90°. Speeds were between 4.5 and 5kts, in that moderate wind (healing 15 – 25°). Moreover, when I tack her, I get surprised that the sail fills so early on the new tack. Ingeborg’s trim hull, heavy ballast and big keel area allows me to sheet the sail in really close. I am quite convinced that I have not owned such a close-winded boat before. Some of you, who have tested my old Johanna, were quite impressed with her, but I would say that Ingeborg is two-three notches faster (Johanna was normally outpointed to windward by a well-sailed Nordic Folkboat). That IF is so eager to go!

    Using the tiller brake:
    I found the tiller brake to work exceptionally well on Ingeborg. We sailed long stretches with the tiller locked (between beam reach and fully close-hauled). Actually, I could leave the tiller locked ‘forever’, except when traffic or lack of water in front of us forced me to take over. At one time we rounded a point and were to bear away a bit. All I did then, was to ease the sheet, and the boat just ’followed the sail’
      -  no need for readjusting the tiller.
    Therefore: I seriously recommend making that tiller lock (..it is more a tiller lock than a tiller brake...).

    Cheers,
    Arne

    PS:
    I begin to wonder if there is an extra advantage with the sloop JR with a fairly broad chord: My guess is that most of the self-steering effect  comes from the movement back and forth of the sail’s  centre of pressure, CP, as the angle of attack, AOA, varies. At a low AOA, the CP moves forward and at a higher AOA, the CP moves aft. On a broad-chord sloop sail, as on Ingeborg (the chord/waterline=0.80), the movement of the CP is enough to give a quite strong self-steering effect (this is helped by the behaviour of the hull; more heel gives more weather helm, etc).



    Last modified: 02 Jun 2017 14:48 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 16 Sep 2016 20:17
    Reply # 4253656 on 3032430
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    Scott,
    yes, that is how I tension the sail along the battens; with lashings. On Johanna’s blue sail (2002), I went in the other direction. After sailing her for a while, I slackened the sail about 1,7% along the battens to aid bulging. This lead to deeper camber   -  and more “smiling wrinkles” along the battens. I felt that that sail became more powerful ( but no guarantees).

     When making a copy of Johanna’s sail for Edmond Dantes (2012), I added more round along each panel and then again added more tension (not extreme) along the battens. I never got along to measure the resulting camber, but it looked good. When making Frøken Sørensen’s sail (2013), I used my Chain Calculator and aimed for 9% camber, but thanks to stretching this sail too along the battens, the resulting camber ended on 8%. Actually that was what I wanted, and I again got this trapeze-like vertical curve.

    So what is best? I doubt if there is much difference. However, I guess I now prefer to have a bit tension to reduce the amount of wrinkles along the battens. I also like the look of the more trapeze-like vertical curve in each panel.

    Remember, my barrel only method is a compromise. If you are a better craftsman and generally in the tidy league, you may get the cambered panels to set better if you insert about three (false or true) broadseams along the rounded curves before assembling the sail, panel by panel. That should remove the wrinkles and most probably not do damage to the main camber.

    Slieve McGalliard has described how to do that.

    I am way too lazy to bother. My main focus with respect to creases is to avoid the big diagonal, camber-robbing ones.

    Arne

    PS:
    Below is a couple of photos from yesterday of Ingeborg’s sail, sailing close-hauled on the mast-to-weather tack. See captions.
    PPS:
    We are enjoying a real Indian Summer here now, so I am glad I am “back in the saddle” again.

     

     

    Last modified: 16 Sep 2016 20:17 | Anonymous member (Administrator)