Clever cheap self steering option

  • 25 May 2014 02:15
    Reply # 1556887 on 1544146
    Deleted user
    Raphael, backup is the better way, this guy had it as his primary and now he is installing a commercial unit..
    You can see the boat "'Hybrid Ark" halfway down the page, he (a German chap) based the design on a 17th century Dutch galleon.
    Last modified: 25 May 2014 10:16 | Deleted user
  • 23 May 2014 13:06
    Reply # 1556380 on 1544146
    Deleted user
    I like this "clever cheap" self steering option a lot, as a backup is case of electric pilot's circuit board or electronic compass failure. Instead of driving a car wash motor, it could also be used to drive a tiller pilot's native motor.

    Also, native autopilot's electronics may be able to control a car wash motor, as a backup in case of autopilot's mechanical faiture...

    Last modified: 23 May 2014 13:10 | Deleted user
  • 30 Apr 2014 12:35
    Reply # 1545257 on 1545228
    Deleted user
    Ash Woods wrote:Hi Gary,

    Am interested in seeing the keel - did you see the actual boat or is there a web site?
    Ash
    The boat is over here in the same anchorage, had a little tour of it. No website that I'm aware of.
  • 30 Apr 2014 10:19
    Reply # 1545228 on 1544146
    Deleted user
    Hi Gary,

    Am interested in seeing the keel - did you see the actual boat or is there a web site?
    Ash
  • 29 Apr 2014 02:02
    Reply # 1544611 on 1544146
    Deleted user
    It's not perfect, its cheap and nasty, the vane can be the size of your hand, just needs to push a switch. But our vane-trim tab can barely do downwind as it is.

    The guy's whole boat was a Rube Goldberg collection. The hydraulic lifting keel, can lift the 60' boat out of the water in shallows. Amazing craft.
    Last modified: 29 Apr 2014 06:04 | Deleted user
  • 28 Apr 2014 14:38
    Reply # 1544254 on 1544146
    Gary King wrote:Saw this on a home built 60' boat yesterday. 

    A car’s windscreen wiper electric motor attached to the helm wheel by belt. It is activated by a small windvane weather cocking on the pilothouse roof, the vane’s shaft comes inside and a tab bolted to it hits electrical switches either side of it. 

    The vane rotates left, it hits the left switch, the motor spins one direction, right the other. A solenoid was used to switch on the motor.

    The owner says it works perfectly except downwind in lighter breezes, which is a complaint for any wind vane.
    So there's no negative feedback built in, no proportionality to the response; it relies on the boat's directional stability. That's why it won't steer downwind. That's why commercial autopilots have some kind of fancy electronic circuitry to make the angle off course proportional to the amount of helm applied.
  • 28 Apr 2014 13:59
    Reply # 1544237 on 1544191
    Deleted user
    Paul Thompson wrote:Yes, it gives you a cheap wind directed autopilot but it completely misses the point when it comes to windvanes, namely a purely mechanical device that need no electrical assistance.

    A windvane gear takes its guidance from the wind and its energy from both the wind and the sea. That is what makes a good system so reliable and desirable. Electricity in boats has become reasonably reliable now days but unfortunately, as convenient as it is, it is still no competition for a well built and sorted windvane system, if you are wanting simplicity and reliability offshore.

    Uh huh, actually, it nails the point.  He just wanted auto steering and the windscreen wiper motor gives it to him.

    The trim tab version we use has some limitations, which we'll just have to live with and the servo pendulum is quite a complicated setup, compared to that wiper motor and a tiny vane.
    But of course, it's not for everyone.
  • 28 Apr 2014 11:49
    Reply # 1544200 on 1544146
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    The auxiliary rudder

     

    There is a third sort of windvane gear that in some cases makes sense to fit: The auxiliary rudder.

     

    If the not-too-big boat has an inboard rudder and there is room on the stern to fit a second one, a perfectly balanced aux. rudder, about 2/3 or ¾ the area of the main rudder , will do the trick.

     

     

    The aux. rudder has some advantages:

    ·         Above all, it is very easy to make for any eager amateur, compared to a servo pendulum system.

    ·         One also gets a fully operational spare rudder in the aux. rudder.

    ·         If the boat lacks directional stability, then locking the main tiller would rectify this. In other words, the boat will be directionally stable at sea, but still be easy to manoeuvre in harbour.

    ·         The main rudder can also be locked after offsetting it a bit to balance out any weather or lee helm, making the job easier for the aux rudder.

     

     

    The aux. rudder is of course controlled by a windvane, either directly by a biggish horizontal shaft vane, or via its own trimtab, driven by a smaller windvane (a vertical shaft vane will  generally do)

     

    The windvane guru, Bill Belcher has shown some good examples of aux. rudders.

     

     

    Cheers, Arne

    Last modified: 28 Apr 2014 11:51 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 28 Apr 2014 11:14
    Reply # 1544191 on 1544146
    Yes, it gives you a cheap wind directed autopilot but it completely misses the point when it comes to windvanes, namely a purely mechanical device that need no electrical assistance.

    A windvane gear takes its guidance from the wind and its energy from both the wind and the sea. That is what makes a good system so reliable and desirable. Electricity in boats has become reasonably reliable now days but unfortunately, as convenient as it is, it is still no competition for a well built and sorted windvane system, if you are wanting simplicity and reliability offshore.

  • 28 Apr 2014 04:58
    Message # 1544146
    Deleted user
    Saw this on a home built 60' boat yesterday. The trick for self steering is to amplify the forces from the wind vane. A pendulum use an paddle in the water, the other type uses a trim tab on the rudder. This one uses a vane and electricity, but its very cheap to make.

    A car’s windscreen wiper electric motor attached to the helm wheel by belt. It is activated by a small windvane weather cocking on the pilothouse roof, the vane’s shaft comes inside and a tab bolted to it hits electrical switches either side of it. 

    The vane rotates left, it hits the left switch, the motor spins one direction, right the other. A solenoid was used to switch on the motor.

    That’s all there is to it. Cheap 2nd hard parts too.

    The owner says it works perfectly except downwind in lighter breezes, which is a complaint for any wind vane.
    Last modified: 28 Apr 2014 04:59 | Deleted user
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