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How to attach blocks to my yards

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  • 29 Nov 2012 20:02
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    Reply # 1148864 on 1140959
    Deleted user
    After thinking I would do something with a thimble, I discovered that the shackles which came with my blocks wouldn't fit over it. (I'm starting to hate SS shackles!) So on to plan C or D here:

    I have a SS ring, and I've lashed it to the yard. I ended up using 1/4" line and doing a shear lashing, with an extra hitch and the tails tied together just because I had some left over. I uploaded a picture here. I'll let you all know if my yards fall down any time soon!
  • 26 Nov 2012 03:15
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    Reply # 1145760 on 1140959
    Deleted user
    For those who are interested I have put several pics of the lashing details on Footprints yard into the Technical Forum Illustrations page. Can't own up to any fancy knots I am sorry, just plain old hitches which seem to work well enough.
  • 25 Nov 2012 23:23
    Quote
    Reply # 1145652 on 1143476
    Deleted user
    Kurt Jon Ulmer wrote:Hi Flutterby,

    The overkill yard sling is what I came up with, using available materials. I had a couple of stainless boom bails but I was certainly not going to bore a bolthole. the massive rope is from the massive original order for the junk rig. My sentiment about overkill is that is has its place(s). Up there, is one.

    Many different particulars will work. EasyGo's examples help make that clear.

    Cheers,
    Kurt 
    Actually the "overkill" I was referring to was a lashing that involved ~15 wraps on your new rig picture. And I have a great deal of respect for the interesting choices which come out of using what is available!

    I want to do something like the Simpler lashing with a thimble in the eye on your old rig. I can see how the line wraps around the yard and the thimble, but couldn't see how it was tied off in your photos. I could probably figure out something to use there (reef knot?) but I'm not quite sure what I'll do.

    The knots I've seen here (like Robert mentioned) are for tying the end of a halyard to a spar, which is a different application.
  • 24 Nov 2012 19:48
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    Reply # 1144969 on 1140959
    Anonymous member

    Having Googled this knot I found instructions (a bit flawed) and a diagram here.

    Following the instructions is a warning that the knot might come loose if tugged sharply.  Worth bearing in mind.

    Then I found a simpler knot called the gaff topsail halyard bend in this location which says it does not tend to work loose when jerking and slating (sic) occurs.

    Last modified: 24 Nov 2012 20:19 | Anonymous member
  • 24 Nov 2012 12:59
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    Reply # 1144794 on 1140959
    Deleted user
    The knot I use for the halyards on our yards is called the"Topsail Halyard Bend" (#1679) in Ashley's Book of Knots. If you don't have access to a hard copy of this book it can be found digitally in Google Books. I find it a great source of creative knot design.

    I splice an  eye in one end to put on a shackle to the block so that it is easily removed. We then use the halyard for lifting heavy items aboard such as water and fuel jugs or the dinghy.

    Using a sling the knot becomes so tight that a marline spike is necessary to loosen. In rope it will be a little loose and I work it up tight.  I try to tied the loop as close to the yard as I can as it will stretch out a bit. I find the yard is much easier to control with the block as close to the yard as I can get it.

    With modern synthetic ropes I have adopted the habit of seizing every knot. Modern ropes are quite slippery and without a seizing are prone to loosening.
    Last modified: 25 Nov 2012 11:25 | Deleted user
  • 23 Nov 2012 20:53
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    Reply # 1144424 on 1140959
    Anonymous member
    On Tystie, there is a span of 6mm bare Dyneema, tied around the yard at the one third and two thirds points with a moulded tunnel (CFRP yard) to retain it. In the middle of the span, I tied in a st. st. 8mm thimble, using an Alpine Butterfly knot, the middleman's tie-in to a climbing rope, able to take a pull in both directions. When I lowered the sail after the 2500 miles from Polynesia, I found that this thimble had fatigued into two pieces. 

    Further, the two wire stays that stabilise my pushpit and carry the sheeting loads have eyebolts at the ends. Halfway through the passage, one of them fatigued, and I replaced it. Three days later the new one fatigued and failed. I replaced it with a lashing of 4mm Dyneema, tensioned by a spanish windlass. No further trouble.

    Two examples of the unreliability of stainless steel, and the superior performance of the modern fibres, Dyneema and Spectra.
  • 23 Nov 2012 03:26
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    Reply # 1143978 on 1141406
    Deleted user
    Robert Groves wrote:... has been replaced with a piece of the same rope we use for the halyards and a multi wrap knot originally designed for the yards on square riggers.

    Choices, choices! I always love when old traditional things like that work well today. Can you give me the name of the knot or a link on how to tie it?

    Thanks,
    Barry
  • 23 Nov 2012 03:23
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    Reply # 1143971 on 1140959
    Deleted user
    Thanks for the reminder, Annie!

    I've done quite a bit of reading about things you can do with high tech lines, and it is very good to test things to destruction so you know how they stand. I don't personally do it, but I like it when others do it for me, giving me that information.

    Fortunately, the soft shackles I've been using were tested, and they are slightly stronger than the line used to make them. (Considering that four passes of the line are holding, this is less impressive than it sounds. FYI the failure point is the diamond knot)

    Many splicing techniques have been well tested also. But indeed, knots that used to be old reliable favorites don't all hold up. (For example, I believe a bowline may sometimes slip)
  • 22 Nov 2012 08:00
    Quote
    Reply # 1143476 on 1141196
    Anonymous member
    Barry & Meps / Stellrecht & Schulte wrote:Thanks for all the thoughts so far. I looked through the pictures I could find and saw that mehitabel  has had a couple different lashings with a thimble and both the halyard block and the YHP block attached to that eye. (I wasn't able to find illuminating pictures of Tystie or Footprints)

    The pictures I saw seemed to include a great number of turns of pretty large rope, which looks like serious overkill. I suspect that they were done to protect the (apparently) wooden yards from a point load. I can't see any reason I would need that with my thick wall aluminum tubes (~1/4 inch / 6mm)

    I'm still thinking about how best to do it, and let me re-state that I really don't want to do any metal work on my yards if i can avoid it.

    Hi Flutterby,

    The overkill yard sling is what I came up with, using available materials. I had a couple of stainless boom bails but I was certainly not going to bore a bolthole. the massive rope is from the massive original order for the junk rig. My sentiment about overkill is that is has its place(s). Up there, is one.

    Many different particulars will work. EasyGo's examples help make that clear.

    Cheers,
    Kurt 
    Last modified: 23 Nov 2012 17:21 | Anonymous member
  • 20 Nov 2012 19:34
    Quote
    Reply # 1142219 on 1141311
    Anonymous member
    David Thatcher wrote:

    ... but where there are high loads I am using spectra braid which has a dyneema core.



    There was a very interesting feature in a recent Yachting Monthly (which I happened to get 'cos there was a piece of mine in it) about tying knots, bends and hitches in rope.  The thrust of the article was how much these weakened the rope (and the article was somewhat flawed by not trying out the carrick bend, which I use all the time and think is excellent).  What I found very interesting and what the testers barely commented on, was that while the deforming of standard polyester braid in order to attach it to something, would weaken the rope by x, y or z, in the dyneema, the rope was weakened by sometimes two or three times that amount, often, if my memory serves, only conserving 20% of its strength.  Unforutnately, I don't have the article with me - I've lent the magazine on - but it was a bit of an eye-opener.
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