Converting a Westerly Nimrod to Junk Rig

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  • 19 Feb 2017 09:12
    Reply # 4617430 on 4550835

    David and a friend, Richard, came to visit me yesterday. We had an interesting discussion on the relative merits of the fantail and weaverbird planforms, and I showed them this:


    Westerly Nimrod 18 with modified weaverbird sail at 15.7 sq m projected area. The battens are exactly 3m long, for best economy.

  • 04 Feb 2017 11:23
    Reply # 4590829 on 4550835

    Here’s a first shot at the rig. This is the Fantail sail, with the bottom panel removed and then scaled down to 14 sq m.

    It looks quite good. The mast LAP is 5m, so you could use a tube as is, with no extension needed. This fits within the boat’s length for trailing. It would be in a tabernacle, which is near perpendicular to the deck, with its bottom where the existing mast strut is now. The sheeting looks OK.




    Last modified: 04 Feb 2017 11:24 | David
  • 01 Feb 2017 18:14
    Reply # 4581231 on 4550835

    Members' Area>Your files> Drawings is the place to look for things like this.

    Fantail mark 2 generic drawing

  • 01 Feb 2017 17:36
    Reply # 4581125 on 4550835

    I'm sure I will get there in the end, but feel I am going round in circles a bit now!

    Can you please show me a Fantail Mk2 sailplan, David? That sounds as if it will fit, but need to look at the CE etc with the boat. Having followed the links that Stuart gave I can see the hinged mast idea could be rather complicated. Perhaps with a boat my size it will be easy enough to step the mast but I must be able to do it on my own and it is hard to know how heavy or cumbersome it will be without actually having it in my hands. I am tempted to get a 5m tube to see what it feels like then make choices later.

  • 31 Jan 2017 19:56
    Reply # 4578157 on 4577815
    David Hall wrote:

    Thank you David and Arne for your responses. I definitely do not want a rig that's a pig to sail! So what I want is a low aspect rig (to keep the mast short) with straight leech - very much open to suggestions. Perhaps first I need to resolve the mast issue though. I need to know exactly how long it will be before anyone can come up with a sail plan. 

    David

    So the fantail sail mark 2 is what you want - low aspect, straight leech, fanned... 

    Actually, it's the other way about: you need to decide on the sailplan before you can come up with the length of the mast.

  • 31 Jan 2017 19:52
    Reply # 4578154 on 4577904
    Stuart Keevil wrote:

    Here's some details from the Tammy Norie Blog

    https://tammynorie.wordpress.com/2014/06/05/mast-hinge-design/

    https://tammynorie.wordpress.com/2014/06/11/making-the-mast-hinge-blood-sweat-and-duralac/

    Yes, indeed, this style of hinge suits boats of Corribbee/Coromandel size and smaller. But it does depend on having some skill in metal working. Some people will like this, others will prefer a wooden tabernacle, still others will just lift the mast into a hole in the deck with the help of a couple of mates.
  • 31 Jan 2017 17:15
    Reply # 4577904 on 4550835

    Here's some details from the Tammy Norie Blog

    https://tammynorie.wordpress.com/2014/06/05/mast-hinge-design/

    https://tammynorie.wordpress.com/2014/06/11/making-the-mast-hinge-blood-sweat-and-duralac/

  • 31 Jan 2017 16:44
    Reply # 4577815 on 4550835

    Thank you David and Arne for your responses. I definitely do not want a rig that's a pig to sail! So what I want is a low aspect rig (to keep the mast short) with straight leech - very much open to suggestions. Perhaps first I need to resolve the mast issue though. I need to know exactly how long it will be before anyone can come up with a sail plan. 

    I take your point about the join, David, but was quite impressed with this type when I watched this video  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Z7AgSFs1OY&sns=em on Youtube. I see the owner, Richard, of Tammy Norie is a JRA member too. Looks ideal method for a trailer sailor but can't see how the hinge works. I have seen another variation on the same idea. On a small boat, the idea of keeping the sail permanently on the short stubby bit makes a lot of sense. On my boat I would not bother with the fancy cover on the sail, just lower the mast into a crutch at the stern and throw a tarp over when I put the boat away.

    David

  • 30 Jan 2017 22:30
    Reply # 4576622 on 4550835
    Anonymous member (Administrator)

    I agree with David about the Reddish sail. I once made (er, tried to make) a Reddish sail for my first boat, Malena (see NL26). Just as David describes, the sheet on my boat wanted to hang itself up each time I tacked.

    Even though I became quite a pro on throwing the sheet over each time I tacked, I decided that this planform was a dead end.

    These days I not only make the leech straight, but also make it set vertically or even leaning a tiny bit aft. In that case one can make long, slow gybes without any batten or boom catching the sheet. That is the ultimate test.

    Arne

    Last modified: 30 Jan 2017 22:34 | Anonymous member (Administrator)
  • 30 Jan 2017 21:57
    Reply # 4576579 on 4575759
    David Hall wrote:

    Thank you again David and Chris.

    That looks like it could work very well and actually very cheap too - though perhaps needs to be anodised. But perhaps not if it says corrosion proof. If I got a 5m and a 2.5m tube I could bury the short one in the hull and then maybe join the two at about boom height. 

    Do you think the Reddish rig will work with the sheeting now that it is reduced, David? I looked at the articles, Chris, but newsletter 68 not there for some reason.

    David

    David, note that you can't join two tubes of the same size end to end without losing strength. You would need a larger tube at the bottom, and that would have to be 4in x 10swg, with casting polyurethane poured in to fill the gap. This can be done, but requires some expertise. It would be easier to make a wooden topmast. 

    I wouldn't want to say that the Reddish rig "works" or "doesn't work". I'd only want to say that on a scale of 1 to 10, I give it 3 for workability. Vincent Reddish derived this rig from the large South China junks, and they had big crews to deal with the sheets as they tacked. There will always be some tendency for the sheet to hang up on the batten ends, even if it's reduced by setting the deck blocks well aft. Convex leeches are bound to be troublesome. This is why, when I was first looking into the design of fanned planform sails, I couldn't think of them as acceptable for use on a small yacht - until I'd found a way to make the leech straight by making the luff convex.

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